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Thread: Ajna- The third eye Chakra(how to stop judging)

  1. #71
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    Re: Ajna- The third eye Chakra(how to stop judging)

    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan
    Rajalakshmi, do you practice saMyama? Do you speak from personal experience? I have asked this of you and of others , yet await the responses.

    Why do I ask? Many have offered posts suggesting what is good vs. what is perhaps a trap on this matter. Yet I hear of no personal experience, as this is of great value.

    It is knowledge + experience that rounds out ones skills... This together IMHO is called wisdom.
    I did not want to answer this question, but since you repeatedly ask - Well, I try to practice....cant say I have progressed much so far...

    How many people in the world are you expecting to have actual samAdhi experience? And even if people claim it anonymously on a forum like this, on what grounds will we beleive in their experience? And what do we do in case of conflicting views between two people claiming personal experience?

    IMHO, we should listen to vasishTa ( scripture) rather than the evolving vishvAmitra ( experience). vasishTa is always firm and unsurpassable and can repel all doubts with ease. Until vishvAmitra reaches the excellence of vashishTa, he is a bundle of confusion and mutual contradiction.

    Keeping this view in mind, all sAdhakas should derive their knowledge from the fountain of eternal wisdom - the vedas, the sUtras, Bhagavad Gita and the purANas. Personal experiences maybe given secondary importance because they are not reliable or neutral sources of knowledge. Even those with personal experience must validate their claims from the scripture for them to be considered as authentic gurus- certainly a person claiming to have knowledge of Brahman must have knowledge of the vedas right? (ekavijJAnena sarvavijJAnaM) These sources of knowledge have withstood the test of time and serve the purpose of all; the personal experience of individuals ( unless these individuals have reached the summit of wisdom) may not be suitable for all....

    ~RL

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    Re: Ajna- The third eye Chakra(how to stop judging)

    namaskar Rajalakshmi and Welcome (belated) to HDF!


    Quote Originally Posted by Rajalakshmi View Post
    Keeping this view in mind, all sAdhakas should derive their knowledge from the fountain of eternal wisdom - the vedas, the sUtras, Bhagavad Gita and the purANas. Personal experiences maybe given secondary importance because they are not reliable or neutral sources of knowledge.
    ~RL
    Should this come with a caveat? My thought is this...

    What of the personal experiences of one's guru?

    Isn't it to the contrary, that 'all sadhakas should derive their knowledge from the fountain of eternal wisdom - their guru!' Granted that for some who do not have a guru, the vedas become the guru or what of the jagad guru? Shiva himself?
    satay

  3. #73
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    Re: Ajna- The third eye Chakra(how to stop judging)

    Quote Originally Posted by satay View Post
    namaskar Rajalakshmi and Welcome (belated) to HDF!




    Should this come with a caveat? My thought is this...

    What of the personal experiences of one's guru?

    Isn't it to the contrary, that 'all sadhakas should derive their knowledge from the fountain of eternal wisdom - their guru!' Granted that for some who do not have a guru, the vedas become the guru or what of the jagad guru? Shiva himself?
    Hello,

    munDaka Up gives the fundamental qualities of the guru we must seek

    pariikshya lokaan.h karmachitaan.h brahmaNo
    nirvedamaayaannaastyakR^itaH kR^itena |
    tadviGYaanaarthaM sa gurumevaabhigachchhet.h
    samitpaaNiH shrotriyaM brahmanishhTham.h || 1.2.12||

    Examining the nature of the regions attained through action and finding out their worthlessness, a wise person should get totally disgusted with them, because that which is not made cannot be attained through what is made or done. For the sake of the knowledge of that (which is not made), one should approach, with Samit in his hand, a preceptor who is well-versed in scriptures and also established in Brahman.

    The guru must be both be well versed in scripture and also be established in Brahman.

    Personal experience is not the only criterion because such an experience ( except for the highest sages) is subjective. For eg, if you take vishvarUpa darshana as an experience criterion, no two sages would have the same experience. Then it becomes a question as to whose experience is more reliable or valid.

    What will you do if one guru ( with some personal experience) says that desire for siddhis is acceptable for sAdhakas, and another guru says otherwise? This is why an accepted authority such as scripture is always needed. If a person is unable to find proof for his statements then his experience need not be taken as a valid pramANa for all.

    There are three stages outlined for sAdhana - shravaNa,manana and nidhidhyAsana. The shravaNa phase is 'hearing' the truth from a guru ( i.e learning). The manana is introspection or analysis of the truth before arriving at a firm conclusion regarding the vedic truth. nidhidhyAsana is the actual upAsana or dhyAna which is based on what you have learnt and arrived at in the earlier stages. This is where you get personal experiences of various forms.

    It should be noted that initiation and learning from guru, and his blessings are very important before the nidhidyAsana stage, which must also be supervised by a guru. Guru must have sufficient knowledge to dispel your doubts, because his experience by itself is unknown to you. It is only to the most gifted students that the guru will be able to give proof of his experiences. Rest of us know the guru's abilities only through his knowledge. If guru's words goes blatantly goes against shruti it is unlikely that he has experienced the actual truth, and probably only had some subjective sublatable experience.

    In a world full of fake godmen and teachers, how will you pick the 'good' ones? Only by his teachings, which must be accordance with shruti. Miracles are not proof of one's divinity and we must be wary. We are certainly not dealing with those few to whom jagadguru Shiva is the guru, who may need no external guidance.

    ~RL

  4. #74

    Re: Ajna- The third eye Chakra(how to stop judging)

    Yavjan is the right one, here, sorry - becoming a demon is so extreme. Do you really think that will happen? If you're afraid of it then yes, you most certainly can and will slip and fall. Fear is such a disastrous catalyst.

    I would begin first with realizing the non-existance of others. You can try that. If that is futile then begin with yourself. If you can let go of preconceptions of yourself and your own actions or reactions, then you can get a handle on your judgements.

    siddhis are for showmanship, but then, of course, what in this wonder-filled universe is not o_O
    Om Hrim Kshraum Ugram Veeram Maha-Vishnum, Jwalantham Sarvatho Mukham Nrisimham Bheeshanam Bhadram Mrityu-Mrityum Namaamyaham

    Follower of Śeṣanaaga

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