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Thread: Caste System

  1. #1
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    Caste System

    Namaste All,

    Here's a documentary on the caste system in India....

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yc7iiFPDbDc

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leUEt...eature=related

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiLFV...eature=related

    I hope people in India see that all are equal....
    May they live what the sacred text teach....
    All is Brahma...

    Peace,
    Soul

    From where does the "I' thought come...
    Go to That...


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    Re: Caste System

    Caste system had been created with good intentions. It had then been foreseen that it would degenerate in course of time in that brahmins & kshatriyas would get corrupted and women, vaishyas, shudras & eunuchs would evolve. Finally eunuchs would rule the world and see its end & destruction. After a confluence period, satya yuga would start again.
    As per the caste system, a most hopeless brahmin is higher than a shudra having 8 siddhis & 9 nidhis.
    Last edited by soham3; 28 January 2008 at 10:21 PM.

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    Re: Caste System

    Hari Om
    ~~~~~

    Quote Originally Posted by soham3 View Post
    Caste system had been created with good intentions. It had then been foressen that it would degenerate in course of time in that brahmins & kshatriyas would get corrupted and women, vaishyas, shudras & eunuchs would evolve. Finally eunuchs would rule the world and see its end & destruction. After a confluence period, satya yuga would start again.
    As per the caste system, a most hopeless brahmin is higher than a shudra having 8 siddhis & 9 nidhis.
    namaste,
    Help us Soham of where this knowledge comes from... this will be helpful to the reader.


    pranams
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

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    Re: Caste System

    Quote Originally Posted by Soul View Post
    Namaste All,

    Here's a documentary on the caste system in India....

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yc7iiFPDbDc

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leUEt...eature=related

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiLFV...eature=related

    I hope people in India see that all are equal....
    May they live what the sacred text teach....
    All is Brahma...

    Peace,
    Soul
    Namaste Soul,

    Please realize that the WHOLE WESTERN WORLD and many Indians themselves are incredibly IGNORANT and frankly stupid when it comes to the Caste System of India. This series of videos is yet another example of the malicious attack on India/Hinduism and her society.

    All men are NOT created equal. If everyone had unity consciousness there would be no caste etc. Remember, caste/class in India is determined by education and cultured behavior! Whereas in the West, class is determined by wealth. Quoting the scriptures and alluding to them when talking about the Caste System makes NO sense because the equality, Brahman, talked about there refers to one's true nature; NOT their 'normal' self. Of course at a deeper level everyTHING is the same, not just people, but try telling that to the so-called 'scholars' of the west. Even so, one's karma & vasanas from previous lives determine how, where, and when you are born.

    Subham.

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    Re: Caste System

    Namaskar!

    Quote Originally Posted by TatTvamAsi View Post
    Namaste Soul,

    Please realize that the WHOLE WESTERN WORLD and many Indians themselves are incredibly IGNORANT and frankly stupid when it comes to the Caste System of India. This series of videos is yet another example of the malicious attack on India/Hinduism and her society.

    All men are NOT created equal. If everyone had unity consciousness there would be no caste etc. Remember, caste/class in India is determined by education and cultured behavior! Whereas in the West, class is determined by wealth. Quoting the scriptures and alluding to them when talking about the Caste System makes NO sense because the equality, Brahman, talked about there refers to one's true nature; NOT their 'normal' self. Of course at a deeper level everyTHING is the same, not just people, but try telling that to the so-called 'scholars' of the west. Even so, one's karma & vasanas from previous lives determine how, where, and when you are born.

    Subham.
    I agree with your post. Many times it is the indians themselves causing this negative propaganda.

    Have you see the movie 'water'? It was only here on HDF that I discovered that the quotes from 'Manu smriti' in the beginning of the movie were wrong translations. How a peson viewing this movie supposed to know that unless they go digging into and researching it?

    I saw one of the videos partly, what's so interesting about them, I don't know.

    Dalits have been crying foul since independence, and western media has nothing else to focus on but social problems of other countries, epsecially india. However, I digress, I don't want to get into the caste/jati/western media/dalit propaganda argument yet once again.
    satay

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    Re: Caste System

    Hari Om
    ~~~~~
    Quote Originally Posted by TatTvamAsi View Post
    Namaste Soul,

    Please realize that the WHOLE WESTERN WORLD and many Indians themselves are incredibly IGNORANT and frankly stupid when it comes to the Caste System of India. This series of videos is yet another example of the malicious attack on India/Hinduism and her society.

    All men are NOT created equal. If everyone had unity consciousness there would be no caste etc. Remember, caste/class in India is determined by education and cultured behavior! Whereas in the West, class is determined by wealth. Quoting the scriptures and alluding to them when talking about the Caste System makes NO sense because the equality, Brahman, talked about there refers to one's true nature; NOT their 'normal' self. Of course at a deeper level everyTHING is the same, not just people, but try telling that to the so-called 'scholars' of the west. Even so, one's karma & vasanas from previous lives determine how, where, and when you are born.

    Subham.
    Namaste TTA

    This notion of all being equal does have deeper significance and IMHO that was where Soul was pointing to... I will let her speak for herself on this matter. You also alluded to this in your post. Yet if the scholars do not know this, then that is okay too. Why so? This revelation is svatasiddha or self proved, that of the SELF or Atman. The scholars may find the definiton is in a book but not the experieince.

    Another POV on equality: the vasanas and karma offered... it too is an equal opportunity employer. If you are born you are a recepitant of these vasanas, like everyone else, equal. You do not get a pass on these offerings. Could you have more or less? Could be, I do not know how to measure it, but you get them just the same. The 'density' I think is of little concern ( for me).

    And as I view it this 'all being equal' has great significance.. As all are an expression of the SELF, anything else is transitory. Does that mean less important? That is a matter of values.

    In the USA when one says All are equal it is the notion that all have an equal opportunity to excel, that is what's equal. There are no kings or queens in the USA by birth or even anointed. Now what wishes to excel at is a different matter.

    It seems to me that before one considers the SELF as paramont all things look and feel un-equal, and that is the true nature of ignorance ... Not that I cannot calculate the square root of 10, but that I have ignored my status in this world, in this space and time as a being.

    Thanks for bringing up this POV. Am I the final authority on this matter. Absolutely not. But as I observe, listen, learn it seems to be the case from my eyes.

    pranams
    Last edited by yajvan; 22 September 2008 at 11:11 AM.
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  7. #7

    Re: Caste System

    Hello TatTvamAsi,

    "Remember, caste/class in India is determined by education and cultured behavior!"

    I think we may have to more or less throw out "education" unless you are speaking of spiritual sciences. (as in the yogas and or universal spiritual laws and practice) Remember how well many of the nazis, as just one example - were educated?

    In relation to that, intelligence can become quite twisted so we can't really go by that as a parameter.

    And "Cultured" may be rather difficult to agree upon although I follow your drift. For instance the totally erotic (and that is putting it very mildly!) carvings displayed on certain temples in India. Also, various cultures often follow the idea of "mother of invention" needs that arise in different areas of the world. And there are battlefields where many lives are lost...not a Jain practice at all as far as I know, but it is a Hindu one. (and countless other examples)

    I use the saying that: a True Lord (or king) does not lord it over on anyone.

    Om

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    Re: Caste System

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob G View Post
    Hello TatTvamAsi,

    "Remember, caste/class in India is determined by education and cultured behavior!"

    I think we may have to more or less throw out "education" unless you are speaking of spiritual sciences. (as in the yogas and or universal spiritual laws and practice) Remember how well many of the nazis, as just one example - were educated?
    Bob,

    Your reference to the Nazis have NO pertinence to India or Hindu culture. Just because Hitler misinterpreted the term Aryan and used the Swastika does not make him a Hindu. I think you misunderstood my statement.

    What I meant was in India, to be considered 'rich', one has to be highly educated and/or lead a virtuous life (aka. in the 'spiritual' sciences as you call it). Meaning, a 'high class' person in India is determined from his birth, character, demeanor, and action; NOT his financial status. However in the West, rich people are worshipped and educated people are ridiculed (as prophecied in the Puranas) by being labeled as 'nerds'/'geeks' etc. In fact, I believe in the West, education holds no value in society as people with money are held up high and those who don't are ill-treated, regardless of their education and background.

    I am not sure what you meant by 'throw out the word 'educated'? Most Indians who emigrated to the US in the 60's & 70's were Brahmins because of the discrimination they faced (still face) in their own country due to the Dalits running the govt. and setting up the ridiculous 'reservation system' akin to the Catholic Schools in the West do. I did not mean just 'spiritual sciences' or learning the Vedas as most of the successful (again, not just wealth wise) Indians in the last 100 years have predominantly been Brahmins; including two Nobel-prize winners in Physics!


    In reference to the Caste System, Brahmins were endowed with not only learning the Vedas, but all types of knowledge; hence most of the brilliant Indians even in the modern era were/are Brahmins. Of course there are exceptions here and there but that is not the rule. In fact, most people from the later part of the 19th Century who were appointed in the top posts by the British govt. in India (based on the ICS) were Brahmins. The reason the other sectors of society were kept aloof is that their strengths vary; for example, a farmer's son will most likely succeed in farming. A Brahmin's son usually became a priest or 'teacher' of some sort. I believe I've explained the Caste System in another post on this Forum. If you do a search you can read it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob G View Post
    And "Cultured" may be rather difficult to agree upon although I follow your drift. For instance the totally erotic (and that is putting it very mildly!) carvings displayed on certain temples in India. Also, various cultures often follow the idea of "mother of invention" needs that arise in different areas of the world. And there are battlefields where many lives are lost...not a Jain practice at all as far as I know, but it is a Hindu one. (and countless other examples)

    I use the saying that: a True Lord (or king) does not lord it over on anyone.

    Om
    I'm afraid you simply don't understand the meaning of 'cultured' and cultured behavior. In fact, one who is an "Aryan" is of noble birth, character, and action! This refers to cultured behavior, demeanor upbringing and background. Your example of the 'idols on the temple walls' makes no sense whatsoever and has nothing to do with what we are talking about here.

    The Dalits and other unwanted elements of society are descendants of murderers, rapists, dacoits, and other criminals. That doesn't make them criminals, but their prediliction to commit sin is far greater than one who is of noble or 'higher' birth, such as a Brahmin. The West, especially the US, will neither understand nor accept this as legitimate due to their own ancestry using the facade of equality etc.

    Subham.

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    Re: Caste System

    Namaste Bob

    Caste is different from class. Class is a scientific denomination used for example in Biology and in Sociology works.
    Caste is a denomination invented by the Portuguese when they arrived in India and is more affective than descriptive as the Indians wore compared each other in accordance or as metaphor to Vine plants. Like a Periquita or a Tinto Ruriz which are different vine plants making different wines. Portuguese do like Wine but that bellongs to another tread or forum.

    And Varna is not caste and is not class.

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    Re: Caste System

    Quote Originally Posted by TatTvamAsi View Post
    Namaste Soul,

    Please realize that the WHOLE WESTERN WORLD and many Indians themselves are incredibly IGNORANT and frankly stupid when it comes to the Caste System of India. This series of videos is yet another example of the malicious attack on India/Hinduism and her society.

    All men are NOT created equal. If everyone had unity consciousness there would be no caste etc. Remember, caste/class in India is determined by education and cultured behavior! Whereas in the West, class is determined by wealth. Quoting the scriptures and alluding to them when talking about the Caste System makes NO sense because the equality, Brahman, talked about there refers to one's true nature; NOT their 'normal' self. Of course at a deeper level everyTHING is the same, not just people, but try telling that to the so-called 'scholars' of the west. Even so, one's karma & vasanas from previous lives determine how, where, and when you are born.

    Subham.
    Is there something you don't want to face ?

    True nature IS expressed in the "normal " self... That is when 'you' are living as Oneness....

    May all wake up... to it's and everyones true and only nature...
    There is not this nature and that nature... to think so is living in duality...

    Many scholars with no practical application to the teachings....

    What use is scriptual knowledge if it is not LIVED?

    Hari Om,
    All is Om,

    Soul

    From where does the "I' thought come...
    Go to That...


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