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Thread: That state before Samadhi

  1. #31
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    Re: That state before Samadhi

    Quote Originally Posted by Znanna View Post
    Namaste,

    As you know, I am uninitated, much less sectarian! LOL

    I was merely commenting on the notion that artistic representations might be storytellings of experiences, in symbolic form.

    From my point of view, if Godz (both unitary and plural damn the sexing) stomps on you, severs your head and sticks out tongue at you (no disrespect intended), then the notion of "free will" somewhat goes by the boards. Don't ask me how I know.

    And, about that tongue thing ... I can vouch as female that sticking out my tongue aligns my body in a way that provokes reaction.

    Honestly, I think that my simplistic interpretation of the artistic paradigm might have some merit.

    OM.ZN
    Namaste ZN,

    Angry? Eh?

    Yes, kAli does all that. Yet stepping on chest of a man (sleeping blissfully with abandon and with no concern) is a different thingy. True the notion of free will is just that -- a notion, except for the only one who is ajar amar and supremely unconcerned. That is a lesson perhaps, for me and for us.

    Om
    Last edited by atanu; 13 May 2009 at 03:07 AM.
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

  2. #32
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    Re: That state before Samadhi

    Quote Originally Posted by atanu View Post
    Namaste ZN,

    Angry? Eh?

    Yes, kAli does all that. Yet stepping on chest of a man (sleeping blissfully with abandon and with no concern) is a different thingy. True the notion of free will is just that -- a notion, except for the only one who is ajar amar and supremely unconcerned. That is a lesson perhaps, for me and for us.

    Om
    Namaste ZN,

    The revelation of kAli stepping on Shiva first came to Vasista, and is interpreted in two ways. Shakti worshippers of Ramakrishna Matha, who are inclined to Advaita, teach the revealed picture as fury of mother nature sustained and stabilised by the immutable unpurturbed. Some others also say that Shakti killed Shiva.

    Which perspective one chooses depends on oneself but it has a relevance to happiness. The former understanding is of Veda-Vedanta of one whole without break and no death. The understanding of the whole is conducive to happiness. Exactly as the happiness of understanding Vishnu and Shiva as opposite, yet complimentery, yet ONE.

    Regards and Love.

    Bro.
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

  3. #33
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    Re: That state before Samadhi

    Quote Originally Posted by Znanna View Post
    Namaste,
    And, about that tongue thing ... I can vouch as female that sticking out my tongue aligns my body in a way that provokes reaction.

    Honestly, I think that my simplistic interpretation of the artistic paradigm might have some merit.

    OM.ZN

    Namaste ZN,

    This is the last post on the series. Without negating your view, i also wish to suggest that the interpretations are often influenced to lesser or greater extent by the cultural bearing of the perceiver. In India, it would be unthinkable that Mother will stick out Her tongue spitefully. Mostly, it is seen as either Jihva (tongue of fire) that laps up everything or as remorse in the way of exclamation "Oh No!"

    No doubt your interpretation of the artistic paradigm has merit, in that we have the common understanding that the notion of so-called human free will is destroyed by Her.

    Regards and Love

    Bro
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

  4. #34
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    Re: That state before Samadhi

    Namaste,

    I do not want to be disrespectful, coming from a chaotic and western pov...

    But it seems to me that there is a literalness in artistic description which supercedes orthodox interpretation.

    "Free will" is academic point of discussion when GodZ kick your ass.

    When Kali-MA tastes your blood, submission is the only option, IMO.


    Love,
    ZN
    yaireva patanaM dravyaiH siddhistaireva choditA .
    shrI kauladarshane chApi bhairaveNa mahAtmanA .

    It is revealed in the sacred doctrine of Kula and by the great Bhairava, that the perfection is achieved by that very means by which fall occurs.

  5. #35
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    Re: That state before Samadhi

    Quote Originally Posted by Znanna View Post
    Namaste,

    "Free will" is academic point of discussion when GodZ kick your ass.

    When Kali-MA tastes your blood, submission is the only option, IMO.


    Love,
    ZN
    My ass is too small for her gigantic kick. A simple nudge from Her made me a devotee and submit long back.

    Om
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

  6. #36

    Re: That state before Samadhi

    Quote Originally Posted by atanu View Post
    Namaskar TTA,

    Thank you for your valuable explanation.

    Atman is Sat-Chit-Ananda. There cannot be a separate existence. That is very dissapointing for many. Nirbija/Nirvikalpa takes away the individuality but depending on samskaras, the individual may come back.

    Also, there are a few levels, as explained above: with or without object; with or without self consciousness etc.. The object of meditation, to start with is important. As Shri Krishna says: What one meditates upon during one's last moments that one becomes.

    I think, all these depend on what Ishwara has planned for each one, depending on karma. He is the one who is Eko and also seated in a particular individuality and He knows what He wants to be next. Though Ego comes to know vaguely as to what motivation is rising and thinks : I wish to become so and so.

    It does not know where from a particular motivation comes.

    Om
    Pranam,
    I think (actually not sure) what is stated above is the answer to my question.


    "My ass is too small for her gigantic kick. A simple nudge from Her made me a devotee and submit long back."

    LOL, WHA HA HA HA HA! Atanu that's funny as h_ _ _! I love this forum, I love all of you guys!

    But seriously, hehehe (sorry, just a little giggles left)
    So if the soul has not attained perfection but the body dies while chanting Om Namah Shivay that soul does what or goes where?

    Namaste,
    Hiwaunis

  7. #37
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    Re: That state before Samadhi

    Quote Originally Posted by Hiwaunis View Post
    Pranam,
    I think (actually not sure) what is stated above is the answer to my question.


    "My ass is too small for her gigantic kick. A simple nudge from Her made me a devotee and submit long back."

    LOL, WHA HA HA HA HA! Atanu that's funny as h_ _ _! I love this forum, I love all of you guys!

    But seriously, hehehe (sorry, just a little giggles left)
    So if the soul has not attained perfection but the body dies while chanting Om Namah Shivay that soul does what or goes where?

    Namaste,
    Hiwaunis
    If body is dropped while chanting Shiva and with consciousness full of meaning of Shiva, one becomes that. But understanding of Shiva may come in many varieties; so again there are millions of possibilities of getting lost in form and name.

    On the other hand, true Shiva is nameless (Svet. Upanishad) and full, nowhere absent, present when there is no night or day; from which the pragnya of Savitur (deity of Sun) proceeds; beyond the category of great or greater or the greatest -- where everyone has to reach eventually. The refuge of all.


    Om Namah Shivaya
    Last edited by atanu; 17 May 2009 at 01:59 AM.
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

  8. #38
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    Re: That state before Samadhi

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    Namasté

    I would assume you are referring to asamprajñāta samādhi? Samādhi comes in a few flavors, so says Patañjali’s yogadarśana, 1st chapter ( called samādhi pāda); Look to the 17th and 18th sūtra-s.
    • nirodha निरोध control , suppression , destruction. Yet of what? The fluxuations of the mind. Some call this the 'arrested state'.
    • samprajñāta सम्प्रज्ञात distinguished , discerned , known accurately; mind is 'partially arrested'.
    • a-samprajñāta or without knowledge, or known accurately - this is the 'fully arrested' state. Some call this objectless i.e. nirvīja made up of nir = nis 'without' + vīja = bīja 'seed' - hence without seed, or objectless.
    Actually samādhi is where there is no mind... svāmī Lakman-jū

    praṇām
    यतसà¥à¤¤à¥à¤µà¤‚ शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṠśivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  9. #39
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    Re: That state before Samadhi

    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post
    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    Namasté

    Actually samādhi is where there is no mind... svāmī Lakman-jū

    praṇām
    Namaste Yajvan Ji,

    Yes. Without the mind, 'this and that' loses its meaning.

    It is further said that there can be two types of absence of mind -- in laya samadhi, where mind is existent but subdued temporarily; and Mano Nasa -- where the mind has been known not to exist at all. What is known as non-existent cannot rise again, though waves may come and go in prakriti. Laya Samadhi, which is akin to sleep, does not remove the avidya.

    Regards

    Om
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

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