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Thread: Some thoughts on mantra

  1. #21
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    Re: Some thoughts on mantra

    Thanks for the explanation and the terminologies Sambya, Atanu and Yajvan!

    I can learn so much more here on HDF on the topic of mantra than I would learn in a whole year reading specialist books.

    Namaste
    "Watch your thoughts, they become words.
    Watch your words, they become actions.
    Watch your actions, they become habits.
    Watch your habits, they become your character.
    Watch your character, it becomes your destiny."

    ॐ गं गणपतये नमः
    Om Gam Ganapataye namah

    लोकाः समस्ताः सुखिनो भवन्तु ।
    Lokaah SamastaaH Sukhino Bhavantu

  2. #22
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    Re: Some thoughts on mantra

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    Namasté
    Quote Originally Posted by atanu View Post
    It is best not to intellectualise the mantra. Thoughts will only multiply. The only thought should be that there is nothing as important as attaining tranquility and concentration of the mind.
    Atanu give wise council here. How so? By engaging the intellect, we engage in action. It is the notion of meditation to settle-down the mind - and as atanu suggests thoughts multiply. That is the nature of the mind.

    What to do? Remain simple my teacher would say. That is, expect nothing ( during meditation). Expectations create effort and this too slows the inward march ( reversing the birth process) of the mind.

    Kṛṣṇa advises in the Bhāgavad gītā, chapt 2, 40th śloka. He says in this (yoga) no effort (abhikrama) is ever lost and no obstacle (pratyavāya&#185 exists. Even a little of this dharma delivers (one) from great fear (bhayāt).

    The wisdom of the ages: withdraw then withdraw from the withdrawal. If this captures your interest, more can be reviewed on this matter as this HDF post: http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/sho...21&postcount=6



    praām

    words
    pratyavāya प्रत्यवाय- decrease, diminution, reversed, reverse, contrary course, opposite i.e. obstacle
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  3. #23
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    Re: Some thoughts on mantra

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    oṁ gajavaktraṁ namaḥ
    ॐ गजवक्त्रं हमः

    Namasté

    I wrote in a previous post ( different folder): http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showpost.php?p=35457&postcount=7
    Lets end this post with the seed-sound of gaṇeśa, gaगं. Holding this vibration we hold gaṇeśa-ji

    I thought to expand this idea a bit on seed (bīja&#185 sound and offer the mūla¹ mantra of gaṇeśa-ji and its review.

    If you recall we discussed bīja sounds above in post 5 above.
    Please be advised that this offering is for the deep appreciation of this mantra and its origin - it is not for instructional purposes.

    This knowledge takes some time to ~sink in~ so let me offer this in two posts.

    Part 1 - From where does it come ?
    This knowledge comes from the atharva veda, gaṇapati atharva-śiṣra. It is worthy to review this name atharva ; It is for atharvan, brahmā's eldest son. We also know that naming of ṛṣi-s and seers have a deeper meaning.
    • Atharvan can be viewed as a+thar+van ; 'a'= not, or no + 'tha' = is fear, danger, some define it as weak or vascillating + 'van' = to conquer, win or become master of. So a+thar+van is he that has no fear (a+tha) or conquers (van) weakness and becomes master (van).
    • Now we can look at this word associated with gaṇapati atharva-śira. We understand the signifinace of atharva , now what of this śira ? It means the head, skull - the seat of the mind and intellect. It is also the upper part, the tip or top i.e. our head is the upper part of our body, and the upper part of the skull-head-mind is the intellect.
      • So śira is an epithet for intellect. But one asks what then is the top/upper part of the intellect? It is mokṣa. Now we have the story for this section of the atharva veda's gaṇapati atharva-śiṣra.
    It is that section that deals with knowledge directed to overcome and conquer weakness or vacillations that leads the intellect to the Divine (gaṇapati). Note gaṇapati is specifically used here i.e. gaṇapati atharva-śiṣra, IMHO because it also infers a devotee of the Divine based the following definition of gaṇapati - Lord of the multitudes:
    • gaa is a flock , troop , multitude , number , tribe , series , class + pati is Lord, master.
    • Yet this pati is also 'husband' when uncompounded. It also can be used as 'wife' when taken as female gender use.
      Hence this word can be used for those devotee's of gaṇeśa i.e. the group/tribe (gaṇa) that are husband or wife (pati) of gaṇeśa.
    I mentioned 'the upper part of the intellect - mokṣa' , lets make another connection.
    Another name for gaṇeśa-ji is gajavaktra (the One with the elephant's mouth or face) and it has much to do with the number 4, 8 and 12.
    In fact one definition for gaja is a name for the number 8 ; gaṇa as in gaṇapati is also a metre with 4 instants or beats. Note that the 4th house ( or bhava from the root √ bhū coming into existence , birth , production , origin ) in jyotiṣ is a mokṣa house, as is the 8th and the 12th.

    We also know that ketu¹ is the grāhaka¹ representative of gaṇeśa-ji. How so? Ketu is the kāraka¹ of mokṣa, liberator from the world. Ketu is also without a head, the same condition gaṇeśa-ji experienced. This is symbolic of not being attached to the world.

    And who owns the 4th tithi (caturṭa or caturthī ) ? Gaṇeśa. And this notion of the 12? If you recall gaṇ - is to count , number , enumerate , sum up , add up . With this we can then take 8+4 and arrive at 12, another mokṣa house. Yet another look - start at the 4th house , add 4 (4+4) we arrive at the 8th; add 4 (8 +4) we arrive at the 12th. All mokṣa houses.

    That gives us some foundation for 4+4=8=gaja and our ability to look at gaṇeśa-ji's mantra rooted in gaṁ.

    What is the link to 8? The mūla mantra is made up of 8 akṣara-s (syllables ~phonemes~); Hence all that we have just said above is the foundation to appreciate why this mantra's 8 akṣara-s have value. We will then pursue the mūla mantra in the upcoming post.


    praṇām


    words for this post and next

    • ketu केतु is the decending node (south) ; ketu means bright appearance , clearness , brightness 'rays of light' ; intellect , judgement , discernment . How is it associated with intellect? Because the word is rooted in cit चित्to perceive , fix the mind upon , attend to , be attentive , observe , take notice of.
      • Ketu is the kāraka¹ of mokṣa, liberator from the world. That is, he has no head - no mind for worldly pursuits i.e. non-attachment. Ketu is a kāraka of intelligence, non-attachment, keen and deep insights, psychic abilities.
    • kāraka (kAraka) कारक- the action making , doing , acting , who or what does or produces or creates; instrumental in bringing about the action . A kAraka is a significator or entity ( in this post a graha or ~ planet) that signifies various matters on this good earth;
    • grāhaka ग्राहक- one who seizes or takes captive ; from grāha ग्रह- seizing , laying hold of , holding i.e. a grāhaka ~seizes~ or influences the circumstances of the native. This is done via the tattva they manage and control.
    • bīja बीज seed; element , primary cause or principle , source ; syllable which forms the essential part of the mantra of any
    • mūla मूल - basis , foundation , cause , origin , commencement , beginning; mūlāt , from the bottom , thoroughly
    Last edited by yajvan; 22 November 2009 at 08:52 PM.
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  4. #24
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    Re: Some thoughts on mantra

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    Namasté
    the seed-sound of gaṇeśa, gaगं. Holding this vibration we hold gaṇeśa-ji
    To take this discussion further it was most appropriate to move Part 2, the continuation of post 23 above, to the Uttara folder. It is posted as 'gaṇeśa's bījākṣara & mantra ' http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=4867

    praṇām
    Last edited by yajvan; 26 November 2009 at 04:22 PM.
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  5. #25

    Re: Some thoughts on mantra

    Namaste
    What Krsn says..
    Yam yam vaapi smaran bhaavam tyajatyante kalevaram;
    Tam tamevaiti kaunteya sadaa tadbhaavabhaavitah.
    Whosoever at the end leaves the body, thinking of any being, to that being only does he
    go, O son of Kunti (Arjuna), because of his constant thought of that being!
    COMMENTARY: The most prominent thought of ones life occupies the mind at the time
    of death. It determines the nature of the body to be attained in the next birth.

    Todays human mostly is the bundle of all evils, if I am right then the main reason is the deteriorating effects of technology , he is slave of the comforts provided and at last he remains in and around it at the death time .He comes again in with unfulfilled desires and is far far away from spirituality.I think an animal when attacked may remember parmatma and get the moksha even .As shruti saysmarta amartyasya te bhuri nam manamahe .rig.
    So bhagwadbhajan is the mere remedyShravanam etc.

  6. #26
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    Re: Some thoughts on mantra

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    Namasté kd gupta

    Quote Originally Posted by kd gupta View Post
    Namaste
    What Krsn says…..
    Yam yam vaapi smaran bhaavam tyajatyante kalevaram;
    Tam tamevaiti kaunteya sadaa tadbhaavabhaavitah.
    Whosoever at the end leaves the body, thinking of any being, to that being only does he
    go, O son of Kunti (Arjuna), because of his constant thought of that being!
    COMMENTARY: The most prominent thought of one’s life occupies the mind at the time of death. It determines the nature of the body to be attained in the next birth.
    What Kṛṣṇa offers and you bring forth is quite profound . Upon death and the process thereof, mutiple things are occuring. To pick up on a particular thought and to keep it will be a high achievement. What is implied by what Kṛṣṇa offers is do not wait until death to groom the mind.
    IMHO he offers, be established in yoga ( union) of the SELF, then at ones end, there is total peace. The body goes its way, as you are in full control of your facilities, possessed of the Divine. Then 'Kṛṣṇa' is totally on ones mind, as the SELF is the extention of HIM. Of what need will there be to have any other thought?

    praṇām
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  7. #27
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    Re: Some thoughts on mantra

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    Namasté

    I wrote,
    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post
    ajapa - If we look at its root 'jap' it's defined as to utter in a low voice , whisper , mutter ; also to invoke or call upon in a low voice. It also means to whisper repeatedly.

    Now we add 'a' to this word which means 'not' , or a negation of the next term. so a+japa means to 'not invoke or whisper, mutter or call upon in a low voice' repeatedly. It simply means the aspirant is no longer voicing a prayer or mantra via the lips and the expulsion of words coming of the mouth does not occur. This word (ajapa) has and is used for mental prayer, invocation, mantra use as it implies no outward movement.
    Simply put the mantra is not voiced, but still occurs in the construct of the mind. A subtle difference wouldn't you say?
    One may note that sounds/mantra can come to a aspirant in a few ways. They can come from ( and be applied) from gross to subtle.

    What is meant by gross is that closest to duality, to the diversity of life. Gross as discussed here is not suggesting mala-s or blemishes but that level of energy fully manifest and co-mingling with all the other diversities of sight, taste, touch, etc.

    So, one can see this inward march to subtle, closer to pure awareness. Hence we can see mantra's come to the aspirant ( and applied) in a few ways :
    • likhita लिखित - means 'written' ; it also means a writing , written document , scripture. This in my view can also be a yantra, where the mantra takes shape as a graphic.
      • A yantra is defined as a symbol for holding and fastening. But what is it holding? One's attention via sight.

    • vaikharī वैखरी- sound; the faculty of speech ; We often hear this is how mantras are communicated - through vāk ( vāc) - speech , voice , talk , language. This was is considered an effective vehicle as the vibration comes by sound and received by ear.
    • upāṃśu उपांशु- in a low voice , in a whisper ; through whispering. As just mentioned, one may receive a vibration via
      the lips of the guru or instructor, via the facility of speech ( vaikharī ) but most likely done in the low voice or whisper.
      One may also apply what is learned via japa , or repetition of the mantra in a whisper or muttering.
    • manasa मनस- mind; through thinking. A mantra could be transmitted to the aspirant via the mind, it is possible. Yet in this case I am suggesting the mantra is used via the mind internally. This is considered ajapa.
    Note that upāṃśu IMHO can also be considered japa जप, as it is considered by definition muttering, whispering. Manasa is internal, with out an outward sound and therefore can be considered ajapa अजप - without muttering on the lips.

    Overall, the attention is directed inward, the march of the mind to end up in no-mind. Finer-and-finer levels of awareness as one settles down the mind. Withdrawing inward till the finest thought is transcended and one arrives at this pure awareness condition. We call this inward march of the mind parivṛtya. This is the notion of turning around and going back. But to what? To one's original state of existence.

    This march is also called pratiprasava ; 'prati' = back , again , in return + prasava. This prasava has a few meanings which apply:
    • prasava is setting or being set in motion;
    • its 2nd definition means pursuit or acquisition.
    • and its 3rd definition is birthplace
    Lets put it all together and we get returning (prati) back , setting in motion the return and acquisition of one's birthplace. And this birth place is full-awareness or the Self ( ātman).

    Hence the use of likhita + vaikharī + upāṃśu + manasa is the march ( the return of) of one's self to one's SELF . This is the march within or pratiprasava.

    praām


    references
    more on this can be read at this HDF post:
    http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/sho...73&postcount=8
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

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