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Thread: "Gurunathan to me"- Some teaching of my Guru

  1. #1
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    "Gurunathan to me"- Some teaching of my Guru

    || AUM shrI paramAtmane namaH ||




    A word to you all with Love

    1
    This knowledge has been transferred to me in various forms of
    Kosha (a Sanskrit word meaning sheath)
    namely anna, praana, mano, vijana and annadamaya.
    Scientific explanation for the annamayakosha experiences can be shown in prasthana thrayi (that too will be an honest attempt).
    (I request to please consider Pratyksha, anumana, upamana, artha pramana too)


    I request you to perform repeated reading of this thread to grasp it in full.


    2
    With around 40 years of milestones, an illusion like ‘internet’ looks real.
    See in HDF, there are characters like Atanu alive, Yajvan alive, Easternmind , Saidevo alive…
    With billions of years of existence, don’t you feel this ‘jagat’ real too?

    But we learn to believe it (not to question it) as illusion,
    That is brahmavidya .
    It believes in Truth; it does not mean to believe the sentences alone.

    3
    I am afraid if anyone comprehends the Western philosophy developed on advaita, which has been translated by Europeans in eighteen hundreds.

    Indians are intelligent. But, strangely enough, they still follow these vague translations. The reason behind it, I really don’t understand.

    This is an ongoing forum with so many explicit thoughts contributed in English and Sanskrit by learned people
    Its my desire to formulate an internet world that discusses Advaita in Enskrit( a suggestion only-a mix of English and Sanskrit)
    I believe languages get developed in communities, but a standardized language gets developed in a civilization.

    I trust HDF to be a high-end advaitic civilization among the internet users.

    But the language makes people fight,
    Some feel linguistically inferior
    Some feel linguistically superior
    They shape language their own way to make others understand
    But fails…
    In short, there is no Vikara in what we discuss.
    There is no energy, the type of energy that develops by chanting divine words.
    English words don’t weave such vibrations
    Don’t worry.
    Civilizations get evolved only with time.

    To try to define a Sanskrit word in advaitic view,
    Strictly follow the definitions,
    Develop a characteristic grammar.

    There are lots of people above 50 years contributing in this forum
    Let them be willing to devote their time (double) for the new generation
    To develop, propagate and encourage a love for Sastra learning among youngsters.
    We heard, read and believed our sages or rishis.

    4
    Population of the world is 6,767,805,208
    Internet users are 1,668,870,408 , a 24.7 % of the total population.
    The growth rate was 362.3 % during 2000-2009

    India has a Population of 1,156,897,766 (1.15 billion)
    Internet users are 81,000,000 (8.1 crores), a 7.0 % of the total population.
    The growth rate was 1520% during 2000-2009
    http://www.internetworldstats.com/

    How many people attend to speak spirituality in the most happening Hindu Forum, ‘HDF’?
    16?

    You can kindly check the other forums as well. HDF stands above all
    http://www.google.co.in/search?hl=en...meta=&aq=f&oq=
    http://www.google.co.in/search?hl=en...meta=&aq=f&oq=

    Thanks to the promoters of HDF for this platform.


    5
    Also these are translations of what is taught in Malayalam, a poetical language
    that has its origin in Sanskrit.
    Also vedic Malayalam is a complete copy of Sanskrit.

    Also to remind, Shri Sankara Padar was born in Kerala (Also called God’s own country).
    http://keralatourism.org/
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kerala


    You will note the fact that
    “why most of the Sanskrit texts are in musical format”
    “why in slokas”
    “why in sutras”
    “why in short”
    “and why not in prose?”
    These Sanskrit texts have been made for billions to use for trillions of years or more.
    It must not confuse the readers.
    (Please note the importance of Sphuta Sastra too)
    Then another question, why are most Upanishads presented in guru - Shishya (teacher-student) format?
    Guru Shishya disclosure creates vikara in the readers.
    Vikara itself can empower your thoughts; word meanings will make you think of the infinite.

    There are personal exclusions in this disclosure.

    This entire incident took place in a span of around 9 years(it is not limited to 6 meetings alone, instead many meeting took place in this span of 9 years, this disclosure is a compilation for the purpose of teaching(beginner and intermediate) .
    Guru lives in an evergreen deep forest of Western Ghats(Kerala side).
    http://whc.unesco.org/en/tentativelists/2103/
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Ghats,

    Guru doesn’t have an ashram, but whoever wishes can go to meet him.
    The rich among the gothra (group of tribes) takes care of him.
    He doesn’t come to anyone; he can’t be recognized by his looks (as a Guru).
    In fact it is a divine light, which leads one to him.
    An Avadhoodha.

    Disclosure is like ‘sutra’ (line that holds meanings together) formats towards the end.


    6
    The situation of the meetings occurred inside a deep forest.
    I wasn’t leading a yogic life in any sense. But I was a bhakta of Lord Shri. Krishna.
    I was trekking with a friend of mine at the
    Western Ghats

    Some weeks before I left for the Western Ghats(just before the 1st meeting with guru) I had met two yogis in Kalady Mutt (the birth place if Shri. Sankara Padar.)
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalady

    That was a very casual meeting; I did not even know they were great yogis.
    But I asked them about Atman(Brahman);
    They said
    “Atman, its not Krishna, its not shiva, its not Brahma, it is not any (deities)devathas you worship, it is even beyond the senses to be explained, it is even beyond the chitta to imagine, it is beyond sushupti, it is beyond kaarana, it is beyond omkara”
    And ended it with
    “turiyam Brahmam”
    “aham Brhmasmi”
    “Tatwamasi”
    “Atha brahma vidya”

    Aum Hari Aum

    “ataH Brahma Vidya”
    “ataH Brahma Vidya”
    “ataH Brahma Vidya”

    This vibrated in my consciousness(this wasn’t used as Maha Vakyas, instead they used it in a sentence.
    Which means
    “pure consciousness is Brahman, I am Brahman, and that is you”
    There for, this is knowledge of Brahman.
    [They slipped in to dhyana (as my knowledge is inadequate for further explanation)]

    God is truth

    According to my Guru Nathan (he told me this in our second to last meeting, which is almost 8 ½ years after the first meeting),
    “Those yogis have already taught you Brahma Vidya,
    This will force you for renunciation.
    If you practice well, it reflects in this birth itself.
    All you need is to beat the planetary powers (gunas)”

    A look (you look or they look) of a yogi itself is Divine.

    BE A YOGI
    Aum tat sat

    Why this disclosure?
    What is the importance of this disclosure?
    ?????????????

    Since Advaita is hard to explain,
    let’s have a ‘vidya’
    that
    helps you to forget the state of dvaitha.

    “Dwaitha naazaka Vidya”
    or
    “A vidya that removes the thoughts of duality”




  2. #2
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    Re: "Gurunathan to me"- Some teaching of my Guru

    || AUM shrI paramAtmane namaH ||


    “Dwaitha naazaka Vidya”

    || ॐ सह नाववतु |
    सह नौ भुनक्तु |
    सह वीर्यं करवावहै |
    तेजस्विनावधीतमस्तु मा विद्विषावहै ||
    ॐ शान्तिः शान्तिः शान्तिः


    AUM saha naavavatu saha nau bhunaktu
    saha viirya.n karavaavahai .
    tejasvinaavadhiitamastu maa vidvishhaavahai ..
    AUM shaantiH shaantiH shaantiH ..


    Literal meaning is not important,
    chant it with love for paramatman,
    and love to know him,
    love to know IT,
    love to know you.




    1st Meeting


    (Very casual meeting), I extend courtesy, and deliberately began to ask about Brahman.

    Me : Pranam guro, what is Brahman?
    GuruNatha” : What do you know about Brahman?
    Me : Bhagavan Krishna is Brahman to me
    G : So you know it
    M : I told the same to the yogis at Kalady.Matt http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalady They said Brahman is much beyond, its not Krishna, its not Shiva, its not Brahma, it is not any of the devathas I worship, it is even beyond the senses to be explained, it is even beyond the chitta to imagine, it is beyond sushupti, it is beyond kaarana, it is beyond omkara, and ended the talk with “turiyam Brahmam”.
    But, are they enlightened to know this?

    G: You did not ask them?
    M : Yes I did, and they said “aham brahmasmi (I am ‘that’). Tatvamasi (‘that’ is you)” and slipped into meditation (as my knowledge is inadequate to explain further)

    G: (Laughing) they are (worshipers) of nirguna nirakara Brahman, it is not different from what you worship.
    But, they enjoy a higher level of aananda, they experience jagat as an illusion, or a magic of the paramatman, they enjoy their jada sharira (Material body) and everything other than atman, as instruments for this magic.

    M: If I worship the way the yogis do, why is it that I don’t experience this Ultimate Reality?
    G: (smile) I guess, you approach reality in a hurry.
    M: I was never in a hurry guro, rather was curious to know the difference between it.
    G: Look, out of curiosity, you seem to forget what the yogis told you.
    M: (recollecting), true, they said it is beyond the senses to be explained.
    G: so the difference between both cannot be explained. Am I right?

    I was confused. So, the Guru continued.

    G: All these deities are landmarks towards the target. You are a traveler in a desert; your target is afar, if you don’t have accurate landmarks set by the wise, you may slip and stumble and settle down at various oases.

    G continues: If some one gets satisfied with the sign board “Welcome to Cochin”,
    Will he reach Cochin?
    Will his purpose be completed at Cochin?
    Will he be satisfied with the visit ultimately?

    M: You mean they are ahead of me…
    G: definitely (with stress)
    M: So, they have already crossed these landmarks?
    G: Not necessary, it might or might not be the same landmarks; they might not have even used any landmarks.

    G continues: the quality of ones birth matters,
    the quality of ones vasanas matters,
    the quality of ones living, thinking, ideas, dedication and patience matters.
    So, does many more qualities. It can never be the same in the path for liberation.

    You can find similarities in people practicing other sciences,
    you see them thinking alike, dressing alike, eating alike, having sex alike,
    many similar ways to seek and attain the state of ecstasy.

    People differ only in their thoughts about themselves.

    G: leave everything, tell me, what you do to progress your path for moksha (liberation)?
    M: Guro, I don’t do anything for moksha, infact I don’t know much about it, I pray to bhagavan only to let me live a peaceful life each day, without any stress and troubles. I pray that I succeed in all my endeavourers, that’s it. I wish to head for moksha that way.

    G: Good, so you yearn for material moksha, material freedom.
    You expect everything to happen well; you don’t let it happen for good.
    You drive the prapancha, the way you desire.

    M: I am not sure, but I don’t expect bad things to happen to me.

    G: You believe in good and bad, Sat and assat. So, you can’t completely get rid of the material (jagat).

    M: I can’t guro, I can’t (I lost myself completely in his energy, illuminating eyes and the divine grin on his lips)

    Nirakara nirguna Brahman wasn’t perfectly explained (at that time.), But, that initiated the quest for nirguna nirakara Brahman, the ultimate reality

    2nd meeting


    M: Pranamam gurudeva,
    G: You again?
    M: Yes, My guro, I think I do search for Krishna in full. I don’t think I am fit for nirguna.
    G: Why do you think so?
    M: I undergo a complete unsteadiness of mind. Each day I am drawn towards karma, with lot more strength and pace.
    I am left unsatisfied. The Lord provides me with more and more dhrvya& Kama than required to survive?
    This excess dhrvya& Kama has become a burden. It not only creates fear in me, but also makes me acquainted with people seeking more dhravya and Kama
    G: (laughing.) Do you practice yoga?
    M: I do, but I don’t practice hatha yoga, I do it differently.
    I sit in a comfortable posture, and practice the technique mentioned in the Gita for about
    80- 100 minutes.
    I don’t follow the breath technique (1:4:2); I just try to see Bhagavan Shri. Krishna in between my eyebrows.
    G: And do you really see it?
    M: I have seen it, but not often. I fear I get collapsed into material life. I keep trying to see it(to see Shri. Krishna), but I don’t enjoy any bliss.
    G: You have tied up your 11 indriyas (njnana 5, karma 5 and mana) but work with chitta (buddhi& ahmkara), boosting up your activities.

    After a couple of seconds, Guru continued with a smile,

    Some do more work with karmendriya (with more physical movements etc)
    Some do more work with jnanendnriya (more with technology, art, etc)
    Some work with buddhi than of other two (head of organizations)

    You tell me who gains more dhrvya& Kama?

    Your conscious mind is completely intact with material, and boosting it up with your mantra and mediation.

    It is not bad.

    But your fear for the material is bad.
    Fear for material, makes material grow (like the fear for existence, make countries expand their army)

    If its so, fear for the Lord in you, makes the Lord in you grow.
    M: I have fear for the lord Guro.
    G: but you don’t love him. You don’t remember him, you don’t even think of Him.
    As a part of routine, you meditate for an hour or so, with an intention (hidden) to boost up your business.

    That’s not athi athmam, it is athi agraham.

    Athaythmam is a tapasya, it is a practice, a practice of divine life, you practice to know yourself before (or after) you leave your jada sharira,

    M: Guro, I lead a divine life too.
    G: Then, what do you mean by divine life?
    M: being pious, performing karma………..(he interrupted me and continued …
    G: You do karma by suppressing all your lust and desire throughout the day. At the end of the day, you want to compensate it with an hour’s meditation.

    You must see Akarma in all your karma; akarma (a stage of no karma or steadiness of mind) is Paramatman.
    So, you try to see Paramatman in all your karma.

    G: What do you see in karma?
    M: Guro, I don’t see karma the way you described.
    G: He described so…
    You think of bank balance while signing a check,
    you think of traffic jam while eating breakfast,
    you think of parties while dressing up,
    you think of dates while seeing women,
    you think of business while praying

    You are physically and mentally involved in karma, which exhausts one easily.

    Gurunathan kept silence


    M: Gurudeva, please be kind enough to advise me the right path to attain shanti.

    G: Karma has to be defined as “action to sustain, with divine thoughts” (thoughts of paramatman)
    Paramatman for you is Bhagavan Hari

    See hari in all your karma. It’s simple

    Jnanam (learning of the material) did not bring you bliss,
    You turned to meditation, which too was not fruitful
    Now you practice to work in the sake of the Lord.
    (At the moment)I don’t see any other method, other than ‘this’ (to work for the sake of Lord), for liberation



    3rd meeting

    M: Pranama Gurudeva,
    G: You look pleasant
    M: Yes gurudeva, I am happier than before. I enjoy happiness which I never enjoyed before,
    I enjoy bliss in everything I do,
    everything I see,
    everything I feel,
    everything I hear and everything I experience.
    The depth of meditation has also have been improved, in two to two and a half hours I could get out of sthula almost completely.

    G: then who is unhappy?

    M: Still I fear something. I am not sure if I will be able to meditate the same way I did today.

    G: (you are) trying to be a yogi in 24 hours!
    (Guru continues and explaining what happened to me),
    You have been in this practice (as per instructions) for 3 years; and you could get out of sthula, but not completely.
    So, what did you do these 3 years in sthula? You made up your mind in mokshsa (learning sastras)

    So now it’s like this;
    Tried 3 years to get out of mooda (to sthula)
    Tried another 3 years to get out of sthula (to suksma)
    Now, try another 3 more years to get out of sukshma (to kaarana),
    And try another 3 more years to get out of kaarana (complete liberation)
    That’s twelve years of dedication for moksha. That’s advised in sastras too.(he proclaimed this alone as Brahma vidya)

    Again he observed silence.


    He slipped into dhayana, so did I start to meditate.

    This time it wasn’t confined to sthula or just sukshma, but explored almost all areas of sukshma loka,
    “Lord, sukshma is so colorful, so infinite, and there is ecstasy in every moment and every single experience.”

    After lunch Gurunathan said: kutty (son),
    Sukshma is infinite, when you start to experience suukhma in full, you will enjoy the fruits of it too, and after experiencing the fruits of the sukshma you come back to sthula.

    That’s like you being in a holiday to sukshma from sthula.
    In suksma, you could work more efficiently and be productive than in sthula.

    The results reach you immediately in sukshma, even the level of enjoyment is better,


    (Serious)But the reflection of all karma in sukshma reflects in sthula as material gains.
    If there is gain there is pain too.

    Are you looking for a similar one (holiday)?
    M: No gurudeva, I was wrong, kindly lead me further.
    G: (smiles) now you experience the sukshma rupa of bhagavan Hari.
    Now you are capable of driving your indiryas to an object which you think is the Paramatman,
    You are now able to control your senses.
    What is that ability called in abhyasa?
    M: Prathyahara
    G: excellent
    And observes silence, I said


    M: For me, indiryas were difficult to be controlled, and buddhi (chitta) stands above all, to know further is going to be even more difficult than all what I have done before.

    G: (smiles) how’s your business? Your marriage? Your parents?
    E: My parents do well; they often force me for a marriage.
    Business is a success now. I pay attention to my expenses than on my profit.
    I generate a sustainable amount, I don’t go for unhealthy competitions, no multiple streams of income, I just implement my unique ideas, and the customers like it.
    I keep a low profile in society, I am happy with it. That provides me material shanti.
    G: You did not tell me, your opinion about marriage.
    M: I have not thought about it, as you advised me earlier, I don’t drive my Buddhi, and instead buddhi drives me ahead.

    G: Isa will guide you (with blessings)
    Now you are in the world of Bhagavan Hari,
    You experience saamipya; you can experience Hari in closer.

    Now you have to experience saarupya (identity of appearance) of Bhagavan Hari

    M: Gurunatha, kindly explain that practice in detail.
    G: what is next to pratyhara?
    M: Guro, its called dharana.
    G: Be one with the rupa of Bhagavan hari.
    Experience Hari in you,
    Experience Hari’s body as your body
    Experience Hari’s crown as your crown
    Experience Hari’s eyes as your eyes,
    Experience Hari’s eyebrows as your eyebrows
    Experience Hari’s nose your nose
    Experience Hari’s cheeks your cheeks
    Experience Hari’s chin as your chin
    Experience Hari’s madhya as your madhya (place between the eyebrows)
    (rest are symbolic and explaining of koshas)
    Experience Hari’s prana as your prana
    Experience Hari’s mano as your mano
    Experience Hari’s jnana as your jnana
    Let the tattwa of aananda be aananada alone.



    It is a level of divine thinking, that, you are hari himself.

    M: sahasra koti pranam gurudeva,(doing sashtanga pranam)

    Like Gurudevan said, things went beyond by calculations.
    Responses from customers were excellent, business reached greater heights; I became healthy, My looks got better and I got reputed in all areas of the pie.
    But this time I was brave enough to handle any situation, but slowly, the sadhana started interrupting.
    I n a way, I had to get busy.
    I recollected gurunathan’s words: “if there is gain there is pain too”
    So, I decided to meet him.

    4th Meeting

    M: pranam gurudeva
    G: (smile) You look like a star sounds like a commet (dhoomaketu)
    You are in more of rajoguna than of satwa and tama:
    During your previous visits you were in satwaguna than of rajo and thama
    The same way, you will have to experience thamoguna than of your satwa and raja.
    Jiva has no other option than to overcome these gunas to attain moksha. It cycles.
    M: Guro, what is the reason behind these gunas?
    G: (smiles) you start to think about Kaarana before you have steadiness in sthula.
    Aum Hari aum

    M: I insulted myself consciously (kept quite)


    G: you don’t worry about it (being busy, lack of time for sadhana); you are in the right path.
    You start to experience what you have gained during the holidays,
    You have worked with your chitta in lot
    You have worked with your sukshma buddhi in lot
    You have worked with your kaarana buddhi in lot
    Unni (son), your body is, only a material cause for all your karma, Karthritwa goes completely to chitta,
    When the chitta is steady, that is the end of all your karma.
    But all that you have imagined (previously) will have to take place, will have to happen in material.
    Whether you enjoy it or not, that will happen for sure.
    These are your karma Phala.
    M: Guro, you mean to say that the karma is ‘chitta vriti’ alone and Akarma is chitta vritti nirodha.
    G: exactly.
    Chitta is mana, buddhi ahmkara


    M: Guro, can you kindly elaborate this mana buddhi ahmakra?
    G: I cannot explain this, because this does not exist.

    But their activities can be explained with some simple examples,(symbolic)
    Imagine,
    You as buddhi
    Your wife as ahmakara
    Your servant as mana

    You start to live in a flat.
    What if the wife listens to the servant and forces you to work accordingly (on the basis of the subjects the servant conferred to your wife)? Will that family experience happiness?

    M: I thought for a second, and said

    so buddhi can have control over ahamkara and mana
    mana can be controlled by both buddhi and ahmkara
    buddhi can be controlled by ahmkara with the help of mana


    G: (with a great smile (humor)) you have grasped it in full except for the fact that, it will take a long for the husband to comprehend it.(symbolic)

    M: with a smile -.

    With buddhi, you see Bhagavan Hari, but ahmkara bonds you again to karma, and stores in mana, passes it over to indiryas and turn it to material.


    M: Now I understand “whatever stored (from previous karma) in my mana is being turned to material these days. That’s why I am getting busy.”
    G: But as long as you practice chitta nirodha, new karmas won’t bond you.
    Siddha, padma asanas will help your buddhi to control ahmkara and mana
    M: (sashtanga prananam)
    G: blessings
    That was not a meeting, but a kind of unification with paramatman,
    I realized, I am in the right path.
    On the way back from western ghats ,I felt myself in real bliss.

    At the check post people looked at me with lot of respect (out of my ahmakra my mana said “I am budhimaan, I look like budhiman, now I know what buddhi is”)

    Look, this is our ahmkara, it chases you every microsecond you live, it works until ahmabodha diminishes completely.



    5th Meeting

    M: Pranam Gurudeva
    G: (only smiled as if he wanted me to initiate the talk)
    M: With your grace , My Guro, I almost got rid of this sthuula nature

    G: (smiles) even I don’t see it (my sthula rupa) much, sukshma buddhi illuminates in you.

    (Immediately with seriousness in vikara)
    You are exhibiting sukshma buddhi to control your sukshma buddhi.
    You can’t forget your body,
    You are concentrating on buddhi which is situated in you, with your buddhi
    It is same but looks separate.
    That is the feeling of the self or jivatma as real
    Your buddhi stops at a point where the real reality starts.
    You are a dualist
    You try to have bhagavan’s nature and to live in this earth for good.
    For you, there is ‘Bhagavan and you’

    M: (in ignorance) you mean I am closer to the experience of those yogis (from Kalady).
    G: never or not yet, now you are closer to the philosophy those yogis preached.
    Gurunathan slipped in to dhyana

    I too started to meditate,(this time it wasn’t for Hari)
    Recollecting the words guru said in his previous speech
    Be one with the rupa of Bhagavan hari.
    Experience Hari in you,
    Experience Hari’s body as your body
    Experience Hari’s crown as your crown
    Experience Hari’s eyes as your eyes,
    Experience Hari’s eyebrows as your eyebrows
    Experience Hari’s nose your nose
    Experience Hari’s cheeks your cheeks
    Experience Hari’s chin as your chin

    Experience Hari’s madhya as your madhya (bhrumadhya, place between the eyebrows)

    I start to see Madhya alone, completely forgetting Hari, that’s seems to me very different from the experiences I ever had.

    I literally entered in the world of kaaranas, the reasons behind everything….

    We sat after lunch
    G: (smile) your father is a monkey, you can’t (not capable enough) even imagine him, and now you are searching for fish (matsya).
    Shiva Shiva Shiva

    (Literally means, I am not even capable of knowing (imagine) the forefathers (monkeys) who lived couple of years ago,
    Still (knowing incapability) I am trying to imagine the beginning of this universe (matsya avathara).
    Shiva (knowledge) Shiva (lord Shiva) Shiva (Ultimate Knowledge)

    (Usually Guru foresees whatever I think)


    This jagath is mithya; your sastras say it between every line.

    Also father of your role model yogi told Brahma Satyam, Jagat Mithya, Jivo Brahmaiva na aparah.( I had a habit to compare myself with the yogis from kalady)

    Tell me,
    What has been created?
    What does exist?
    What is going to end?

    You are thinking about something, that doesn’t exist.
    You are thinking about shapes that don’t exist
    You are thinking about lights that don’t exist
    You are thinking about relations that don’t exist
    You are thinking about deities that don’t exist
    You are thinking about sciences that don’t exist

    Thinking about something, which don’t exist, is called “dreaming”

    You are only a dreamer.

    Tell me, in what sense are you a yogi?
    M: (simply bowed, kept quite)

    (You have to understand how this conversation started. Unlike the previous meetings, dialogues in the coming meetings are more symbolic, Gurunathan literally transferring this knowledge to me, and it might not have sthula nature in full. Also Malayalam is a very poetical language, Vedic Malayalam originated almost completely from Sanskrit; I have tried my best to translate it)

    G: Leave all that.

    Ravi is a friend of Bindu, if you love Ravi, bindu come by herself
    Sit in pure lotus,
    If you think of yoni, bindu will go, then(if bindu goes) think of yoni
    Orelse bija will come,
    if not(if bija doesn’t come)
    Nabho turns khechari
    Naada comes inbetween.
    Where does naada ends? Turiyam
    Then there is Maya(also), she is troublesome, but fears bindu(as he said it is important to know maya, equally its not important for who has bindu)

    Turiyam bhrhmam (Guru slipped in to dhyana)

    I too meditated

    He continued after some time:
    (Stopped anna)You have already won annamaya kosha (physical body)
    (Stopped vaayu)You have already gained control over pranamayakosha (pranic body)
    (Stop mana)Now you can gain control over manomaya kosha (senses and mana)
    (Stop budhi)Then you can gain control over vijnanamaya kosha (buddhi and ahmkara)
    And finally you can be one with the supreme kosha that is anandamaya kosha

    When you gain complete control over vijnanamaya kosha,
    Karya, kaarana, ends
    That is the end of buddhi, (sabijam)
    When ahmkara ends its called (nirbija)
    {Basically that is described as the shiva and shakti, at sabija we gain control over consciouness(shiva) but the prapancha tries to bond you again and again(swabhava of the prapancha is ahmakara). One need to gain control over prapancha too for moksha}
    That’s the end of chitta, turiyam
    [Some sastras call it turiyatitam (some think thuriya is an act of chitta and when chitta ends, it merges with super soul called turiyatita), there is no soul and super soul, but both are one.]


    M: Gurudeva, you said Maya is troublesome, what is Maya?
    G:
    Do you think your eyes see?
    Do you think your ears hear?
    Do you think your nose smell?
    Do you think your skin touch?
    Do you think your tongue taste?
    Do you think your mind enjoys it?
    Do you think your buddhi knows it?
    Do you think your ego experiences it?
    Atman experiences it. Iswara experiences it, Isa is the karya, kaarana, kartritvam
    At the same time it not the karya, karrana., kartirtuvam

    Guru kept silent about 2 two minutes (I kept thinking about it, and guru continued)

    G: But you think your eyes see, right?
    But even when your eyes are closed, you still see; you see better scenes than you see with your eyes.

    M: yes gurunathan, I see even when my eyes are closed
    G: It happens with your Manomaya kosha

    annamaya kosha joins pranamaya kosha and manomaykosha enjoys prakriti(seeing with your eyes) right?

    Sometimes pranamaya kosha joins manomayakosha and enjoys prakriti, that is Maya
    (The foolish in sthula doesn’t realize this attachment of manomaya with pranamaya)

    Sometimes manomayakosha alone enjoys prakriti. (That is dreams)

    Sometimes vijnanamaya kosha enjoys prakriti (dreamless state, sushupti, kaarana)

    When, anandamaya kosha enjoys,
    That is satchitaanandam, brahmanandam, paramanandam,

    Now you know, the concept of Jivatman arises from the formation of annamaya, pranamaya, manomaya Vijnanamaya and Aanandamaya kosha.

    You also know, aanandamaya kosha has no karthritwa.
    Infact, these sastras all are the reflections of the swabhava of the vijnanamaya,

    M: Guro tell me the swabhava of these koshas
    G: Sthuula prakriti is of (ahmam kara, or disintegration, break into parts or components or lose cohesion or unity)

    Muula prakriti is of (bliss, unity)
    Anna, prana, manomaya koshas has the swabhava of the sthula prakriti
    Vijanamaya kosha shows swabhava of both sthula (aham) & moola (bliss) prakriti.

    This multiple swabhva of the vijnanamaya, makes prapanncha real.

    M: so the buddhi of jiva is only a swabhava of the moola prakriti, it’s not real
    G: very good,
    Like you be with your parents for long time and start to show their character
    Like you be with your friends in hostel for sometime and start to show their character
    Gradually you start to show characters of both.

    Vijnanamaya is showing the swabhava (characters) of both muula and sthula
    Budhi of vaijnanamaya is, the reflection of the bliss of the annandamaya kosha
    Buddhi is not real.

    You show the characters of your friends and father, but you are you alone, its only a reflection of their characters.
    The aananadamaya kosha is the core of brhamanda
    That’s atman, whatever disintegrated from ataman are not real. It is infinite.

    He kept silence

    M: So death is basically a separation of anamaya and paranamaya from the manoamaya and vijanamaya
    G: very good,

    Its only breaking apart of that particular formation of these koshas

    Punarjanma is the reformation of this vijnana, mano, prana mayakoshas with another annamaya kosha according to the vasanas of the manomaya.

    M: Guro, what does this aanandamaya kosha do?
    G: ananadamaya alone is real, that alone is the unknown mass, which alone is the energy
    Without aanaandamaya, none of these koshas move.
    Koshas are made of panchabhutas, panchabhutas are dead particles.
    It will just be dead particles without annandamaya, the core of bramanda

    You must have seen stones transforming to beautiful shapes, they too have the light of aanandamaya, they too have ahmabodha, and they tend to break apart…

    He slipped into mediation ……

    G: knowing koshas are again a consciousness (knowledge). Whether it be aananda or vijnana, these names or terminologies belong to a science which is a hindrance to the real science of god.
    The ultimate reality is end of all these knowledge,

    Because the knower, knowing and the known are one.

    In dual perspective,
    the mind stands as both paramatman and prakriti,
    this is chitta and ahmakara,

    the mind, chitta and ahmkara unites the real knowledge occurs,

    That oneness is unification (there is no Jivatma and paramatman)
    It is a matter of knowledge alone, which is transcendental knowledge or the knowledge of Brahman (Brahman’s knowledge)

    G: whatever exist in this prapancha are the parts of Brahman, Brahman knows it. Brahman is not affected by Maya, like a magician is not hypnotized himself, by hiss own magic.

    Also we know that, those who have practiced the magic understand it (the trick of magician) to be an illusion.

    If one needs to understand the magic of paramatman, he needs to transcend maya by all means.

    Trigunas are only fluctuations of Maya.

    Brahman exists in its sthula, sukshma kaarana and turiya nature, ‘kosha formations’/(Jivatma) affected by Maya experiences it as various forms of prapancha.
    This is knowledge.
    Experiencing Brahman in its turiya nature alone, is transcendental knowledge.



    || ॐ सह नाववतु |
    सह नौ भुनक्तु |
    सह वीर्यं करवावहै |
    तेजस्विनावधीतमस्तु मा विद्विषावहै ||
    ॐ शान्तिः शान्तिः शान्तिः



    || हरि ॐ तत् सत् ||

  3. #3
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    Re: "Gurunathan to me"- Some teaching of my Guru

    .


    My sincere thanks to Atanu,

    Also to Saidevo, Yajvan, Easternmind, Spiritualseeker, syunyata,

    tatvamasi, devotee, Bhaktijan, kdGupta and to everyone else in the forum.

    This forum has been a great inspiration to me.

    ॐ तत् सत्




    .

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    Re: "Gurunathan to me"- Some teaching of my Guru

    Thanks Brahman for the excellent post that goes through entire gamut very systematically. Thanks for remembering me and other friends also. Great. Also, I commend your spiritual attainments, which atanu is still striving for.

    Best wishes
    Last edited by atanu; 06 November 2009 at 05:43 AM. Reason: Addition
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

  5. #5

    Re: "Gurunathan to me"- Some teaching of my Guru

    Amid pageantry, merrymaking, festivities, cultures and colors, we meet at HDF

    Brahman, “HDF-a high-end advaitic civilization among the Internet users”- that’s an adorable slogan.

    Brahman, you asked, “How many people attend to speak spirituality in the most happening Hindu forum, HDF?”

    Right from this question, the entire collection of thoughts you posted, retains a hallowed meaning. To be frank, I experienced an awakening feeling, similar to the one felt on the discourse between Arjuna and Lord Krishna, the discourse that took me to learning the Ultimate.

    I refer to the 1st meeting in Brahman’s post:

    G; People differ only in their thoughts about themselves.
    G: You expect everything to happen well: you don’t let it happen for good.”

    I found the core of the gamut (thanks Atanuji for the word) in the above sentences.

    “The sun shines every morning to wake you up, it never fails. You need to decide whether you need to wake up.”


    If we all were created for the one reason of the unification with the Paramatma, the revelation that we differ in just one quality- the knowledge about ourselves- the Paramatma in us, the God in us, - is a shock.

    We are discussing the essence of all our being, and let that thought create energy that steers us, an energy similar to one we acquire in chanting divine words.

    Brahman, let the Advaita discussion in Enskrit be a respectful beginning. It was a commendable effort.

  6. #6
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    Re: "Gurunathan to me"- Some teaching of my Guru

    Quote Originally Posted by atanu View Post
    Thanks Brahman for the excellent post that goes through entire gamut very systematically. Thanks for remembering me and other friends also. Great. Also, I commend your spiritual attainments, which atanu is still striving for.

    Best wishes
    Your commend is a necklace to this simple ‘margadarsanamala’.

    Which is contradictory compared to the upper philosophical preaching.
    Here in this thread I have stopped conversation at a point where the real confusion starts to occur.

    I have not meant it for those who have really following a certain path, instead I was eying on the new generation who struggles to find an answer ‘how bliss’?

    In fact their questions end up in consumption of substances like “soma” to get high on and to experience the bliss.

    I have not tried to pop anything other than Karma,
    For the purpose of doing so, I had to come across many practices like Bhakti, Sastras, assumptions etc…

    Karma is defined as ‘action to sustain with Devine thoughts’

    Devine thoughts are thoughts of Brahman

    When thoughts of Brahman seems difficult, it is advisable to think of the self
    That is Bhakti.
    Infact Bhakti is “Knower of the self mediates by the self, upon the self.”

    Thoughts of the self can be in the form of the manifest or unmanifest.

    Thus bhakti has been charged with idol worship, but it not wrong when practiced with jnana.

    In my opinion there is nothing other than karma and jnana for attainment of the ultimate freedom.

    Karma with Devine thoughts easily leads one to the attainment of jnana


    Thanks for your time Atanu.

  7. #7
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    Re: "Gurunathan to me"- Some teaching of my Guru

    Quote Originally Posted by akshara View Post
    Amid pageantry, merrymaking, festivities, cultures and colors, we meet at HDF

    Brahman, “HDF-a high-end advaitic civilization among the Internet users”- that’s an adorable slogan.

    Brahman, you asked, “How many people attend to speak spirituality in the most happening Hindu forum, HDF?”

    Right from this question, the entire collection of thoughts you posted, retains a hallowed meaning. To be frank, I experienced an awakening feeling, similar to the one felt on the discourse between Arjuna and Lord Krishna, the discourse that took me to learning the Ultimate.

    I refer to the 1st meeting in Brahman’s post:

    G; People differ only in their thoughts about themselves.
    G: You expect everything to happen well: you don’t let it happen for good.”

    I found the core of the gamut (thanks Atanuji for the word) in the above sentences.

    “The sun shines every morning to wake you up, it never fails. You need to decide whether you need to wake up.”


    If we all were created for the one reason of the unification with the Paramatma, the revelation that we differ in just one quality- the knowledge about ourselves- the Paramatma in us, the God in us, - is a shock.

    We are discussing the essence of all our being, and let that thought create energy that steers us, an energy similar to one we acquire in chanting divine words.

    Brahman, let the Advaita discussion in Enskrit be a respectful beginning. It was a commendable effort.

    Thanks Akshara for your time on my thread

    My favorite quote remains as ,
    Karma is ‘action to sustain with Devine thoughts’



    .

  8. #8

    Re: "Gurunathan to me"- Some teaching of my Guru

    Thank You for this precious thread, the insight and conversation with the Guru and other Siddhas.
    There is so much packed in here
    I come back here to read it from time to time
    Never told you that before

    praNAm
    || Shri KRshNArpaNamastu ||

  9. #9
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    Re: "Gurunathan to me"- Some teaching of my Guru

    Re: "Gurunathan to me"- Some teaching of my Guru

    He continued after some time:
    (Stopped anna)You have already won annamaya kosha (physical body)
    (Stopped vaayu)You have already gained control over pranamayakosha (pranic body)
    (Stop mana)Now you can gain control over manomaya kosha (senses and mana)
    (Stop budhi)Then you can gain control over vijnanamaya kosha (buddhi and ahmkara)
    And finally you can be one with the supreme kosha that is anandamaya kosha

    When you gain complete control over vijnanamaya kosha,
    Karya, kaarana, ends
    That is the end of buddhi, (sabijam)
    When ahmkara ends its called (nirbija)....

    Quote Originally Posted by smaranam View Post
    Namaste Snip

    I agree. I don't think Anandamaya Kosh is something to overcome, like the other layers. Its where we want to be, as you said.

    Also, I would think Manomaya Kosha = layer of mind rather than consciousness. Its Anandamaya alone that touches consciousness and hence bliss.



    Jai Sri Krshna
    praNAm
    Dear Smaranam,

    I am happy; my thread was of use to you.

    The concept of Koshas is very difficult to have it discussed.

    Still, relying on a purely subjective experience aided by my Gurunathan’s teachings, I have attempted to discuss it.

    The discussion at "Gurunathan to me" should apparently seem not so significant to the advanced level learners. It was compiled for the beginners and intermediate levels of sadhaka alone. (That was mentioned in the post)

    Fourth pada of the consciousness is bliss alone; there are no koshas at this level.
    The forth pada, being indefinable and beyond the senses to be explained, can be a topic for discussion among a group of highly learned sadhkas alone. (Even a telepathic conference would yield result, but never with a stranger).

    Again, the ‘medium’ of transfer of knowledge being aanadamaya itself, the senses(anna& prana) or the mind(manomaya) or the intellect(vijnana) is incapable of transferring that amount of energy.

    Then what was the purpose of “Gurunathan to me”?

    A bhakta yogi keeps his consciousness steady on the aanadamaya kosha than the other koshas. One who contemplates on the rupa of deities enjoys aananda, gradually starts to realize the acts of koshas , but how does it differ from the real tatwa?

    Tatwa of aanandamaya is experience. Accordingly, one attains ultimate bliss and experiences eternal love. THAT is the experience of Advaita, one without a second, seer being one with seen.

    In other words, aanandmaya is the truth at vyvharic level, at paramarthic level there is no existence of koshas.

    THAT is Brahman

    lots of love

  10. #10

    Re: "Gurunathan to me"- Some teaching of my Guru

    Quote Originally Posted by brahman View Post
    A bhakta yogi keeps his consciousness steady on the aanadamaya kosha than the other koshas. One who contemplates on the rupa of deities enjoys aananda, gradually starts to realize the acts of koshas , but how does it differ from the real tatwa?

    Tatwa of aanandamaya is experience. Accordingly, one attains ultimate bliss and experiences eternal love. THAT is the experience of Advaita, one without a second, seer being one with seen.

    In other words, aanandmaya is the truth at vyvharic level, at paramarthic level there is no existence of koshas.

    THAT is Brahman

    lots of love
    praNAm Brahman

    Thank you so much.

    ***So, Snip was right about overcoming all koshas ***

    Your Gurunathan thread was so carefully written for beginners and intermediate sadhaka , but I have to read it several times to understand as I am only a beginner.

    The easiest for me is the silence spiralling towards nivrtti that is very comforting, as if a big burden of any thought , sankalp, aasakti has just been taken off.

    But then that does not remain, inspite of knowing this is 'sukh' ( THAT , Tat, Krshna for me) , and I am back into things.

    (I have had a feeling of telepathy with people , some I never met, but that I am sure must be something completely different from the telepathy you are talking about.)

    I shall come back to this new post and let things sink in more, and ask any qns I may have.

    I can feel the peace - shanti in your words, posts.

    Thank You

    smaranam



    || Shri KRshNArpaNamastu ||

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