Giving things up?

[Tirisilex]

Do I need to give certain things up to be a follower of Advaita? For example I like to play Roleplaying Games.. Do I need to give this up?

[devotee]

What is the genesis of this weird idea ? :?

[Tirisilex]

I was just reading some site and it was saying that certain things can be an obstacle to practice.. and I just remembered hearing people from ISKCON talking about giving things up for Krishna.. So it just got me thinking this..

[devotee]

Yes, there is a need to distinguish between what is impermanent, unreal & what is real & permanent. Slowly as the wisdom dawns upon you, you will go from unreal to real ... from illusion of pains & pleasures to bliss.

The necessary requirements of all paths are more or less the same : purity in thoughts & actions, not harming any beings, love everyone & all, see same supreme reality in all, yogic exercises for keeping body fit for spiritual progress, discipline in your daily life required for meditation & evenness of mind, slow detachment from worldly pleasures etc.

OM

[Eastern Mind]

I was just reading some site and it was saying that certain things can be an obstacle to practice.. and I just remembered hearing people from ISKCON talking about giving things up for Krishna.. So it just got me thinking this..

Vanakkam Tirisilex: There are tons of obstacles. One of Ganesha's names is 'Remover of Obstacles' Vignesvara I believe, if memory serves. The intellect is an obstacle. Attachment is another. All sorts of emotions like impatience are there too. When the attachment becomes an addivtion, its clearly an obstacle. If you have a chosen sadhana time, and you stay here on HDF discussing things, then HDF is an obstacle.

The term my Guru used was 'affectionate detachment' which basically means loving everything, but from a certain emotional distance. Not to get emotionally attached. Be the watcher of not only your environment, but also of your own mind. This leads to increased discipline.

I agree totally with Devotee's wise comments. It takes time, and eventually, it all comes together.

But certainly it can be tricky discerning the dharmic way of action. Take for example, a Mother outside of an extended family. She is doing japa, and the baby starts to cry. Is the baby an obstacle to the religious pursuit? Or is the religious pursuit an obstacle to the dharma of raising baby?

So in the end we even have to detach ourselves from religious observances themselves.

Aum Namasivaya

[AwareConsciousness]

I think the 'ascetic approach' or whatever you want to call it is inherently flawed. I think this stems from a misunderstanding of the whole process. Devotees behold their gurus leading ascetic lives and so mimic them in the hope of attaining their 'bliss'. But they fail to see that the ascetic life is something that develops spontaneously after awareness when all material attachments are transcended and when it is clearly perceived that such existence is seen as unnecessary for a joyful life. And so we have these religious people who torture themselves, practice self-denial and who are further from the truth than the dancing, wine-drinking Zorba (who is actually a Buddha). It is not necessary, in my opinion to renounce anything. All the great masters have attested to this: Atmananda, Nisargadatta (he was a shopkeeper his whole life!), Ramana (the direct path is as effective as bhakti), Osho (Zorba the Buddha), Chinmayananda. Plenty more...

[Sherab]

I think the 'ascetic approach' or whatever you want to call it is inherently flawed. I think this stems from a misunderstanding of the whole process. Devotees behold their gurus leading ascetic lives and so mimic them in the hope of attaining their 'bliss'. But they fail to see that the ascetic life is something that develops spontaneously after awareness when all material attachments are transcended and when it is clearly perceived that such existence is seen as unnecessary for a joyful life. And so we have these religious people who torture themselves, practice self-denial and who are further from the truth than the dancing, wine-drinking Zorba (who is actually a Buddha). It is not necessary, in my opinion to renounce anything. All the great masters have attested to this: Atmananda, Nisargadatta (he was a shopkeeper his whole life!), Ramana (the direct path is as effective as bhakti), Osho (Zorba the Buddha), Chinmayananda. Plenty more...

Osho isn't really a good example, he's a total cult leader, and his books reek of brain washing....

no offense meant...

namaste.

[Eastern Mind]

Vannakkam Hindu souls:

Although the 'ascetic approach' is often considered flawed by new age Gurus, within traditional Hinduism the wandering ascetic or his brethen the monk staying within the monastic order of an established peetam, math, or adheenam (monasteries) is as commonplace today as it was 3000 years ago. (I'm not actually sure, but at least it's common.) Some of the wandering Nayanars, great bhaktars of God, and countless Hindu Swamis, Gurus, and Rishis over the years took the 'ascetic approach'. The idea that it is somehow flawed seems preposterous. Its totally an essential part of traditional Hinduism.

Of course, what Ramana (Famed Hindu that he was) said about it actually being in the mind is true. Of course his view is from the already realised pure Advaitic non-dual perspective. This is not quite so with the ordinary man. One can certainly make choices to make affectionate detachment easier. Many lifestyle choices. such as not starting addictive habits, or doing everything in moderation are a couple of examples. I choose to not walk the streets of certain areas within the city after midnight. That's just wisdom. When we're browsing the net, and out of nowhere an anti-Hindu or porn site pops up, we can hit the 'continue' or the 'back' button with no reaction at all, or we can sit there and let some lower emotion take us over. Its just a bit of will.

Sherab: Osho himself discarded Hinduism. It was the western press that made the association. They are like that. Funny thing they didn't associate Jim Jones to Hinduism back then. Neither would they associate him to Christianity.

Aum Namasivaya

[Sherab]

Vannakkam Hindu souls:

Although the 'ascetic approach' is often considered flawed by new age Gurus, within traditional Hinduism the wandering ascetic or his brethen the monk staying within the monastic order of an established peetam, math, or adheenam (monasteries) is as commonplace today as it was 3000 years ago. (I'm not actually sure, but at least it's common.) Some of the wandering Nayanars, great bhaktars of God, and countless Hindu Swamis, Gurus, and Rishis over the years took the 'ascetic approach'. The idea that it is somehow flawed seems preposterous. Its totally an essential part of traditional Hinduism.

Of course, what Ramana (Famed Hindu that he was) said about it actually being in the mind is true. Of course his view is from the already realised pure Advaitic non-dual perspective. This is not quite so with the ordinary man. One can certainly make choices to make affectionate detachment easier. Many lifestyle choices. such as not starting addictive habits, or doing everything in moderation are a couple of examples. I choose to not walk the streets of certain areas within the city after midnight. That's just wisdom. When we're browsing the net, and out of nowhere an anti-Hindu or porn site pops up, we can hit the 'continue' or the 'back' button with no reaction at all, or we can sit there and let some lower emotion take us over. Its just a bit of will.

Sherab: Osho himself discarded Hinduism. It was the western press that made the association. They are like that. Funny thing they didn't associate Jim Jones to Hinduism back then. Neither would they associate him to Christianity.

Aum Namasivaya

It's not that he discarded hinduism: it's the teachings I have read. Never sat well with me at all. :P

[Eastern Mind]

It's not that he discarded hinduism: it's the teachings I have read. Never sat well with me at all. :P

Vannakkam: You are probably correct. I actually don't know much of his teachings for disinterest. I do remember he was born into a Jain family, and his brand of sannyasins were termed neo-sannyasin for some reason by somebody.

Aum Namasivaya