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  1. #1
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    Confused

    Confised as to the path that I should be following. I'm studying the teachings of Satguru Subramuniyaswami, Sai Baba and Swami Chinmayananda. There seems to be truth in what they all say. Is it best to pick one school of thought or should I continue to study all at the same time? I'm praying to Lord Murugan for guidance but know that the experience of those on this board has great merit. Would a guru be an appropriate guide? I guess that I just need some answers and guidance but the more I learn, the more questions and seemingly the more confused I become. Any insight would be helpful.

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    Re: Confused

    Quote Originally Posted by c.smith
    Confised as to the path that I should be following. I'm studying the teachings of Satguru Subramuniyaswami, Sai Baba and Swami Chinmayananda. There seems to be truth in what they all say. Is it best to pick one school of thought or should I continue to study all at the same time? I'm praying to Lord Murugan for guidance but know that the experience of those on this board has great merit. Would a guru be an appropriate guide? I guess that I just need some answers and guidance but the more I learn, the more questions and seemingly the more confused I become. Any insight would be helpful.
    namaste,
    sanatana dharma can be so simple as 'just pray to god' or 'sit silently and watch' or it can be as vast as the ocean that one lifetime is not enough to even touch and fully appreciate all of the different thoughts. Ultimately, all thoughts merge into one...

    In my case, I am trying to study as many schools of thought as I can possibly get my hands on. In the end I now that contradictions and confusion is just because we are not transcending to the level we should be and because we are trying to analyse the thoughts with our own narrow focus. Ultimately, it will all make sense. In my opinion, you might be trying to hard.

    Let go, and allow 'it' happen!
    satay

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    Re: Confused

    Quote Originally Posted by c.smith
    Confised as to the path that I should be following. I'm studying the teachings of Satguru Subramuniyaswami, Sai Baba and Swami Chinmayananda. There seems to be truth in what they all say. Is it best to pick one school of thought or should I continue to study all at the same time? I'm praying to Lord Murugan for guidance but know that the experience of those on this board has great merit. Would a guru be an appropriate guide? I guess that I just need some answers and guidance but the more I learn, the more questions and seemingly the more confused I become. Any insight would be helpful.
    I think it is much better to concentrate on practise of religion than theory. A refreshing morning prayer before going for job, and some meditation before going to bed are what would be ideal.( or whatever else is taught by the guru) Apart from that, spare time can optionally be used for learning and reading...Excessive learning and trying to explore the "inner" meanings of scriptures can lead one to becoming an atheist or a bookworm, unless there is proper guidance.

    Any learning has to be unlearned in the end. Keep it simple and dont bother to read much. People who read a lot will just keep doing that - and loose out on practice, and thus any value on their learning.
    Guard your Dharma, Burn the Myth, Promote the Truth, Crush the superstition.

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    Re: Confused

    Quote Originally Posted by c.smith
    Confised as to the path that I should be following. I'm studying the teachings of Satguru Subramuniyaswami, Sai Baba and Swami Chinmayananda. There seems to be truth in what they all say. Is it best to pick one school of thought or should I continue to study all at the same time? I'm praying to Lord Murugan for guidance but know that the experience of those on this board has great merit. Would a guru be an appropriate guide? I guess that I just need some answers and guidance but the more I learn, the more questions and seemingly the more confused I become. Any insight would be helpful.
    The words of Satguru Sivaya Subramuniyaswami him-self will be the answer for your confusion.
    I will copy something from one of the books he wrote:


    By http://www.himalayanacademy.com/reso...lws_ch-08.html
    Monday
    LESSON 50
    Scriptural Listening

    Siddhanta shravana, scriptural study, the sixth niyama, is the end of the search. Prior to this end, prior to finding the satguru, we are free to study all the scriptures of the world, of all religions, relate and interrelate them in our mind, manipulate their meanings and justify their final conclusions. We are free to study all of the sects and sampradayas, all denominations, lineages and teachings, everything under the banner of Hinduism -- the Saivites, the Vaishnavites, the Smartas, Ganapatis, Ayyappans, Shaktas and Murugans and their branches.

    Scriptures within Hinduism are voluminous. The methods of teaching are awesome in their multiplicity. As for teachers, there is one on every corner in India. Ask a simple question of an elder, and he is duty-bound to give a lengthy response from the window he is looking out of, opened by the sampradaya he or his family has subscribed to, maybe centuries ago, of one or another sect within this great pantheon we call Hinduism.

    Before we come to the fullness of siddhanta shravana, we are also free to investigate psychologies, psychiatries, pseudo-sciences, ways of behavior of the human species, existentialism, humanism, secular humanism, materialism and the many other modern "-isms," which are so multitudinous and still multiplying. Their spokesmen are many. Libraries are full of them. All the "-isms" and "-ologies" are there, and they beckon, hands outstretched to receive, to seduce, sometimes even seize, the seeker. The seeker on the path of siddhanta shravana who is at least relatively successful at the ten restraints must make a choice. He knows he has to. He knows he must. He has just entered the consciousness of the muladhara chakra and is becoming steadfast on the upward climb.

    Have full faith that when your guru does appear, after you have made yourself ready through the ten restraints and the first five practices, you will know in every nerve current of your being that this is your guide on the path through the next five practices: 1) siddhanta shravana, scriptural study -- following one verbal lineage and not pursuing any others; 2) mati, cognition -- developing a spiritual will and intellect with a guru's guidance; 3) vrata, sacred vows -- fulfilling religious vows, rules, and observances faithfully; 4) japa, recitation of holy mantras -- here we seek initiation from the guru to perform this practice and; 5) tapas, performing austerity, sadhana, penance and sacrifice, also under the guru's guidance.

    Siddhanta shravana is a discipline, an ancient traditional practice in satguru lineages, to carry the devotee from one chakra in consciousness to another. Each sampradaya defends its own teachings and principles against other sampradayas to maintain its pristine purity and admonishes followers from investigating any of them. Such exploration of other texts should all be done before seeking to fulfill siddhanta shravana. Once under the direction of and having been accepted by a guru, any further delving into extraneous doctrines would be disapproved and disallowed.

    Siddhanta shravana is more than just focusing on a single doctrine. It is developing through scriptural study an entirely new mind fabric, subconsciously and consciously, which will entertain an explanation for all future prarabdha karmas and karmas created in this life to be experienced for the duration of the physical life of the disciple. Siddhanta shravana is even more. It lays the foundation for initiation within the fabric of the nerve system of the disciple. Even more, it portrays any differences in his thinking, the guru's thought, the sampradaya's principles, philosophy and underlying practices.

    Tuesday
    LESSON 51
    Transmitting Tradition

    Siddhanta shravana literally means "scriptural listening." It is one thing to read the Vedas, Upanishads and Yoga Sutras, but it is quite another to hear their teachings from one who knows, because it is through hearing that the transmission of subtle knowledge occurs, from knower to seeker. And that is why listening is preferred over intellectual study.

    Because sound is the first creation, knowledge is transferred through sound of all kinds. It is important that one listen to the highest truths of a sampradaya from one who has realized them. The words, of course, will be familiar. They have been read by the devotee literally hundreds of times, but to hear them from the mouth of the enlightened rishi is to absorb his unspoken realization, as he re-realizes his realization while he reads them and speaks them out. This is Saiva Siddhanta. This is true sampradaya -- thought, meaning and knowledge conveyed through words spoken by one who has realized the Ultimate. The words will be heard, the meaning the satguru understands as meaning will be absorbed by the subconscious mind of the devotee, and the superconscious, intuitive knowledge will impress the subsuperconscious mind of the devotees who absorb it, who milk it out of the satguru himself. This and only this changes the life pattern of the devotee. There is no other way. This is why one must come to the guru open, like a child, ready and willing to absorb, and to go through many tests. And this is why one must choose one's guru wisely and be ready for such an event in one's life.

    Sampradaya actually means an orally transmitted tradition, unwritten and unrecorded in any other way. True, satgurus of sampradayas do write books nowadays, make tape recordings, videos and correspond. This is mini-sampradaya, the bud of a flower before opening, the shell of an egg before the bird hatches and flies off, the cocoon before the butterfly emerges. This is mini-sampradaya -- just a taste, but it does lay a foundation within the shishya's mind of who the guru is, what he thinks, what he represents, the beginning and ending of his path, the sampradaya he represents, carries forth and is bound to carry forth to the next generation, the next and the next. But really potent sampradaya is listening, actually listening to the guru's words, his explanations. It stimulates thought. Once-remembered words take on new meanings. Old knowledge is burnt out and replaced with new. This is sampradaya.

    Are you ready for a satguru? Perhaps not. When you are ready, and he comes into your life through a dream, a vision or a personal meeting, the process begins. The devotee takes one step toward the guru -- a simple meeting, a simple dream. The guru is bound to take nine steps toward the devotee, not ten, not eleven or twelve, only nine, and then wait for the devotee to take one more step. Then another nine ensue. This is the dance. This is sampradaya.

    When a spiritual experience comes, a real awakening of light, a flash of realization, a knowing that has never been seen in print, or if it had been is long-since forgotten, it gives great courage to the devotee to find that it had already been experienced and written about by others within his chosen sampradaya.

    If all the temples were destroyed, the gurus would come forth and rebuild them. If all the scriptures were destroyed, the rishis would reincarnate and rewrite them. If all the gurus, swamis, rishis, sadhus, saints and sages were systematically destroyed, they would take births here and there around the globe and continue as if nothing had ever happened. So secure is the Eternal Truth on the planet, so unshakable, that it forges ahead undaunted through the mouths of many. It forges ahead undaunted through the temples' open doors. It forges ahead undaunted in scriptures now lodged in nearly every library in the world. It forges ahead undaunted, mystically hidden from the unworthy, revealed only to the worthy, who restrain themselves by observing some or all of the yamas and who practice a few niyamas.

    Coming under a satguru of one lineage, all scripture, temple and home tradition may be taken away from the eyes of the experience of the newly accepted devotee. In another tradition, scripture may be taken away and temple worship allowed to remain, so that only the words of the guru are heard. In still another tradition, the temple, the scripture and the voice of the guru are always there -- but traditionally only the scripture which has the approval of the satguru and is totally in accord with his principles, practices and the underlying philosophy of the sampradaya.

    Wednesday
    LESSON 52
    One Focus Per Lifetime

    Life is long; there are apparently many years ahead. But time is short. One never knows when he is going to die. The purpose of sampradaya is to restrict and narrow down, to reach out to an attainable goal. We must not consider our life and expected longevity as giving us the time and permission to do investigative comparisons of one sampradaya to another. This may be done before making up one's mind to follow a traditional verbal lineage. After that, pursuing other paths, even in passing, would be totally unacceptable.

    But it is also totally unacceptable to assume the attitude of denigration of other paths, or to assume the attitude that "our way is the only way." There are fourteen currents in the spine. Each one is a valid way to escalate consciousness into the chakra at the top of the skull and beyond. And at every point in time, there is a living guru, possessing a physical body, ordained to control one or more of these nadis, currents, within the spine. All are valid paths. One should not present itself as superseding another. Let here be no mistake about this.

    The yamas and niyamas are the core of Hindu disciplines and restraints for individuals, groups, communities and nations. In fact, they outline various stages of the path in the development of the soul, leading out of the marul pada into the arul pada, from confusion into grace, leading to the feet of the satguru, as the last five practices indicate -- siddhanta shravana, mati, vrata, japa and tapas.

    Since the sampradayas are all based on Hinduism, which is based on the Vedas, any teacher of Indian spirituality who rejects the Vedas is therefore not a Hindu and should not be considered as such. Anybody in his right mind will be able to accept the last section of the Vedas, the Upanishads, and see the truth therein. One at least has to accept that as the basis of siddhanta shravana. If even that is rejected, we must consider the teacher a promulgator of a new Indian religion, neo-American religion, neo-European religion, neo-New-Age religion, nonreligion, neo-sannyasi religion, or some other "neo-ism" or "neo-ology." This is not sampradaya. This is not siddhanta shravana. This is what we speak against. These are not the eternal paths. Why? Because they have not been tried and tested. They are not based on traditional lineages; nor have they survived the ravages of time, changing societies, wars, famine and the infiltration of ignorance.

    For sadhakas, yogis, swamis and mendicants who have freed themselves from the world, permanently or for a period of time according to their vows, these yamas and niyamas are not only restraints and practices, but mandatory controls. They are not only practices, but obligatory disciplines, and once performed with this belief and attitude, they will surely lead the mendicant to his chosen goal, which can only be the height that his prarabdha karmas in this life permit, unless those karmas are burned out under extreme tapas under the guidance of a satguru.

    Some might still wonder, why limit oneself to listening to scripture of one particular lineage, especially if it has been practically memorized? The answer is that what has been learned must be experienced personally, and experience comes in many depths. This is the purpose of disregarding or rejecting all other sampradayas, -ism's, -ologies and sects, or denominations, and of limiting scriptural listening to just one sampradaya, so that each subtle increment of the divine truths amplified within it is realized through personal experience. This and only this -- experience, realization, illumination -- can be carried on to the next birth. What one has merely memorized is not transforming and is forgotten perhaps shortly after death. Let there be no mistake that siddhanta shravana, scriptural listening, is the only way; and when the seeker is ready, the guru will appear and enter his life.

  5. #5
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    Arrow Re: Confused

    Namaste,

    Every true Dharma or Deva or Vidya, and every Sampradaya (and indeed every luminous Guru), has its own COMPLETE understanding. It is an excellent idea to learn about many different Religions and Philosophies, but your own understanding and personal practice should remain focused and absolutely true to just one course.

    The fundamental importance of a Guru in the whole concept of Sanatana or Arsha (from the Rishis ~ i.e. the Revealers ~ the spiritual teachers or Gurus) Dharma has been repeatedly stressed!

    “Hinduism” = indudharma = sindhudharma = sanAtanadharma = ArSadharma = ArSabhadharma !

    And the way of the Rishis has long followed Nandi’s own path.
    Quote Originally Posted by C.Smith

    When is one ready to seek the advice of a Guru? I've seen from some posts that a Guru is not necessary or that one may use other means to fulfill such, but my hunger for knowledge leaves me wanting.
    In Sanatana Dharma, unless you an exceptionally gifted individual, a wise Guru is absolutely required.

    And yes, the Guru will always appear at the appropriate juncture, only you must be ready to recognize him/her (and this is where many seekers fail).

    You should continue to attend your chosen Mandir, and offer devotion to your chosen Deity ~ and perhaps you could try to learn a little of some Indian language.

    And in order to correctly perform Puja, Japa, Kirtan, etc., you will of course need at least some understanding of Sanskrit.

    Continue your preparations for the journey and, when you are confident, set out with devotion on a Yatra to your desired Tirtha, and along the way you are sure to encounter your own true Guru.

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    Re: Confused

    I would say following more then one Gurus teachings is perfectly acceptable! every Guru has something different to offer! im sure thats why there are so many. in my opinion following just one would limit you to just that Gurus knowledge you might then miss out on something offered by another Guru. I always look at a guru as a spiritual teacher. in the school of life! like a public school offers many classes and teachers, so does life. i hope this helps.

  7. #7
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    Re: Confused

    I'm not sure if it is wise to 'follow' more than one guru. Study?..perhaps Since it is the guru who chooses the disciple, not the other way around, I'm not sure if too many gurus out there would take you on if you came clean and told them you already have a guru. Sounds like an opportunity to get more confused. I thought some of the previous posts on this subject were super. Once you have a particular path, best to stick with it, for all paths lead to the same apex, no? I also think it is much easier if you meet the guru in person rather than reading the books. Then you have a better inner feel for it. Aum Namashivaya

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