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Thread: What is the goal of life?

  1. #11
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    Re: What is the goal of life?

    namaste Atanu.

    Quote Originally Posted by atanu View Post
    Obviously it is not easy to be still, so we have to do karma, which must be alligned to prescriptions, yet prescriptions may vary a lot. Thus, a path, prescribed for me by Guru/God/Nature/ Circumstance/Birth/Coincidence (and whatever) is unique for me. Yet the fact remains that everyone is seeking unalloyed bliss. And Upanishad says that "Self is Bliss unlimited." Regarding the goal also, i cite only the following two, mentioning that Upanishads abound with one single instruction.
    You have given a nice, down-to-earth summary. Let us make even more down-to-earth and say:

    The one word, one practical/practicable word, that includes everything
    a person needs to do here,
    for the svarga hereafter,
    and the ultimate goal of mokSha
    (a laconic term for a state of existence which is here and now)
    is dharma. That is, dharma = mokSha.

    Says the mahAnArAyaNa upaniShad of the kRShNa yajur veda:

    धर्मो विश्वस्य जगतः प्रतिष्ठा
    लोके धर्मिष्ठ प्रजा उपसर्पन्ति
    धर्मेण पापम्-अपनुदति
    धर्मे सर्व प्रतिष्ठितं
    तस्माद् धर्म परमं वदन्ति ॥७९.७॥

    dharmo vishvasya jagataH pratiShThA
    loke dharmiShTha prajA upasarpanti
    dharmeNa pApam-apanudati
    dharme sarva pratiShThitaM
    tasmAd dharma paramaM vadanti ||79.7||

    • Dharma is the support--pratiShThA, of all--vishvasya, universe--jagat.

    • In this world--loke, to one who is fully devoted to dharma--dharmiShTha,
    subjects--prajA, approach--upasarpanti.

    • By dharma--dharmeNa, (a person) chases away--apanudati, sin--pApam.

    • In dharma--dharme, all/everything--sarvam, is supported--pratiShThitam.

    • Therefore--tasmAd, they say--vadanti, that dharma is supreme--paramam,
    as well as the means of liberation--mokSha-sAdhanam.

    By the last statement is understood that dharma is both the means and the end; it is the path and the goal. No wonder then, that our religion is called the sanAtana dharma.

    svadharma for the svargam; sanAtana dharma for the mokSham.
    svadharma is personal; sanAtana dharma is universal--and eternal.
    रत्नाकरधौतपदां हिमालयकिरीटिनीम् ।
    ब्रह्मराजर्षिररत्नाढ्यां वन्दे भारतमातरम् ॥

    To her whose feet are washed by the ocean, who wears the Himalayas as her crown, and is adorned with the gems of rishis and kings, to Mother India, do I bow down in respect.

    --viShNu purANam

  2. #12
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    Re: What is the goal of life?

    Quote Originally Posted by saidevo View Post
    namaste Atanu.

    You have given a nice, down-to-earth summary. Let us make even more down-to-earth and say:

    The one word, one practical/practicable word, that includes everything
    a person needs to do here,
    for the svarga hereafter,
    and the ultimate goal of mokSha
    (a laconic term for a state of existence which is here and now)
    is dharma. That is, dharma = mokSha.

    Says the mahAnArAyaNa upaniShad of the kRShNa yajur veda:

    धर्मो विश्वस्य जगतः प्रतिष्ठा
    लोके धर्मिष्ठ प्रजा उपसर्पन्ति
    धर्मेण पापम्-अपनुदति
    धर्मे सर्व प्रतिष्ठितं
    तस्माद् धर्म परमं वदन्ति ॥७९.७॥

    dharmo vishvasya jagataH pratiShThA
    loke dharmiShTha prajA upasarpanti
    dharmeNa pApam-apanudati
    dharme sarva pratiShThitaM
    tasmAd dharma paramaM vadanti ||79.7||

    • Dharma is the support--pratiShThA, of all--vishvasya, universe--jagat.

    • In this world--loke, to one who is fully devoted to dharma--dharmiShTha,
    subjects--prajA, approach--upasarpanti.

    • By dharma--dharmeNa, (a person) chases away--apanudati, sin--pApam.

    • In dharma--dharme, all/everything--sarvam, is supported--pratiShThitam.

    • Therefore--tasmAd, they say--vadanti, that dharma is supreme--paramam,
    as well as the means of liberation--mokSha-sAdhanam.

    By the last statement is understood that dharma is both the means and the end; it is the path and the goal. No wonder then, that our religion is called the sanAtana dharma.

    svadharma for the svargam; sanAtana dharma for the mokSham.
    svadharma is personal; sanAtana dharma is universal--and eternal.
    Namaste Saidevoji

    Thanks for citing a valuable conversation of Aruni and Prajapati and for distinguishing svadharma and sanatana dharma. The full conversation goes on like this:


    Mahanarayaana Up.

    LXXIX-1: Aruni, the son of Prajapati and Suparna approached his father Prajapati – thus we have heard – and questioned him, what is that which revered teachers declare as the supreme means of liberation ? To him Prajapati thus replied:

    LXXIX-2: By truth the wind blows. By truth the sun shines in the sky. Truth is the foundation of speech. Everything in practical life depends on truth. Therefore they say truth is the supreme means of liberation.

    LXXIX-3: Be Tapas performed in the beginning gods attained godhood. By Tapas seers attained to heaven gradually. By Tapas we get rid of our enemies who stand in the way of our acquisitions. Everything is founded in Tapas. Therefore they say Tapas is the supreme (means of liberation).

    LXXIX-4: Persons who practise sense-control shake off their sin by that. Perfect ascetics reached heaven gradually through sense-control. Sense-control is inaccessible to ordinary creatures. Everything is founded in sense-control. Therefore they say sense-control is the supreme (means of liberation).

    LXXIX-5: Those who are of a tranquil disposition do good merely by calmness. Sages have attained to heaven through calmness of mind. Calmness of mind is inaccessible for the ordinary creatures. Everything is founded on calmness of mind. Therefore they say that calmness of mind is the supreme means of liberation.

    LXXIX-6: Giving of gift in the shape of dakshina is the secure abode of the sacrifices. In the world all creatures subsist on a giver. People remove by gifts those who are envious and malignant towards them. By gift the unfriendly become friendly. Everything is established in gift. Therefore they say that the gift is the supreme means of liberation.

    LXXIX-7: Dharma, religious righteousness, is the support of the whole universe. All people draw near a person who is fully devoted to dharma. Through dharma a person chases away sin. All are supported by dharma. Therefore they say that dharma is the supreme means of liberation.

    LXXIX-8: In this world procreation is certainly the foundation of the race. A person who extends the continuity of progeny in the right way by rearing offsprings, according to the scriptural rules, discharges his debt towards his departed ancestors. That alone is the way for him to pay off his debts towards his ancestors. Therefore they say that procreation is the supreme means of liberation.

    LXXIX-9: The great sacrificial Fires are indeed the three-fold knowledge and the path leading to godhood. Of them, the Garhapatya Fire is Rig-Veda, the earth and the Rathantara Saman chant; Anvaharyapachana is Yajur-Veda mid-region and the Vamadevya Saman chant; Ahavaniya is the Sama-Veda, the heavenly worlds and the Brihat Saman chant. Therefore they say that the sacrificial Fires are the supreme means of liberation.

    LXXIX-10: The performance of Agnihotra at dawn and sunset is an expiation for sins incidental to house-keeping. It is a good yaga and a good homa and also it is the commencement of all yajna-s and kratu-s. It is a beacon to the heavenly world. Therefore they say Agnihotra is the supreme means of liberation.

    LXXIX-11: Others devoted to the Vedic religion say that sacrifice is the means of liberation. Sacrifice is indeed dear to gods. Verily gods have attained to heaven by their previous deeds of sacrifice. They have driven away demons by sacrifice. By sacrifice those who are hostile become friendly. Everything is supported by sacrifice. Therefore they say sacrifice is the supreme means of liberation.

    LXXIX-12: Inward worship or mental concentration is indeed the means of attaining to the state of Prajapati and so that is holy. Those who possess a mind endowed with the power of inward concentration see and realise what is good. Through mental concentration, seers like Vishvamitra created subjects by mere wish. All depends upon this power of the mind. Therefore they say that the power of inward concentration is the supreme means of liberation.

    LXXIX-13: Wise seers declare that Sannyasa mentioned as the supreme means of liberation is Brahman, and that Brahman is the Universal Spirit, is supremely blissful, is self-born, is the protector of created beings, is the soul of time, and so forth.

    LXXIX-14: The year is the yonder sun. That Person who is in the sun is Hiranyagarbha; He is Parameshthin (the protector of the universe) and Brahmatman – Supreme Reality that is the innermost Self of all creatures.

    LXXIX-15: Those rays by which the sun gives heat, the same rays transform water into rain-cloud which showers the rain. By the rain-cloud herbs and trees come into existence. From herbs and trees food is produced. By the use of food the breaths and sense are nourished. When the life-breath is nourished one gets bodily strength. Bodily strength gives the capacity to practise Tapas (in the shape of self-control, religious fast and so forth). As the result of such Tapas, faith in scriptural truths springs into existence. By faith mental power comes. By mental power sense-control is made possible. By sense-control reflection is engendered. From reflection calmness of mind results. Conclusive experience of Truth follows calmness. By conclusive experience of Truth remembrance of It is engendered. Remembrance produces continuous remembrance. From continuous remembrance results unbroken direct realization of Truth. By such realization a person knows the Atman. For this reason, he who gives food gives all these. For, it is found that the vital breaths and the senses of creatures are from food, that reflection functions with the vital breath and the senses, that unbroken direct realization comes from reflection and that bliss comes from unbroken direct realization of Truth. Thus having attained bliss one becomes the Supreme which is the source of the universe.

    LXXIX-16: He by whom all thus universe is pervaded – the earth and the mid-region, the heaven and the quarters and the sub-quarters – that Person is fivefold and is constituted of five substances. He who has attained supreme knowledge through Sannyasa is, indeed, this Person. He is all that is perceptible at present, was in the past and will be in the future. Through apparently human, his true nature is that which is settled by the enquiry into the Vedas and what is attained by his new birth in right knowledge. He is firmly established in the richness of knowledge imparted by his guru, as also in his faith and in Truth. He has become the self-resplendent. Being such a one he remains beyond the darkness of ignorance. O Aruni, having become one possessed of knowledge by realizing Him, the Supreme, through Sannyasa and with your mind fixed in the heart, do not again fall a prey to death. Because Sannyasa is thus the supreme means of realization, therefore wise men declare that to be above all other means of liberation.

    LXXIX-17: O Supreme, Thou art the giver of the wealth of supreme knowledge to us. Thou hast become all. Thou unitest the individual Souls in the Sutratman. Thou pervadest the universe. Thou art the giver of the lustre to fire. Thou art the giver of light and heat to the sun. Thou art the bestower of the riches of light to the moon. Thou art taken in the upayama vessel as soma juice for oblation. We worship Thee the Supreme who art such for the manifestation of Light.

    LXXIX-18: (The Sannyasin having meditated upon the Supreme) should concentrate his thoughts on Him uttering the syllable Om. This, the syllable Om, verily is the substance of many great Upanishads and a secret guarded by the gods without imparting to the unfit. He who practises meditation on the Supreme thus with the aid of Pranava after Sannyasa attains to the unlimited greatness of the Supreme. By that he attains to the greatness of Brahman. Thus the secret knowledge has been imparted.

    LXXX-1: The institutor of the sacrifice, in the case of the sacrifice offered by a Sannyasin who has attained supreme knowledge in the manner already described, is his own Self. His faith is his wife; his body is his sacrificial fuel; his chest is his altar; his hairs are his holy grass; the Veda he has learnt is his tuft of hair; his heart is his sacrificial post; his desire is his clarified butter; his anger is his animal to be immolated; his austerity is his fire; his sense-control is his immolator; his gifts are his dakshina; his speech is his Hotir priest; his breath is his Udgatir priest; his sight is his Adhvaryu priest; his mind is his Brahman priest; his hearing is his Agnid priest; the span of his life is his preparatory rite; what he eats that is his oblation; what he drinks that is his drinking of soma juice; when he delights himself that is his Upasad rite; when he walks, sits and stands that is his Pravargya rite; that which is his mouth that is his Ahavaniya Fire; that which is his utterance that is his offering of oblation; that which is his knowledge that is his Homa sacrifices; when he eats in the afternoon and forenoon that is his Samid-homa (oblation of fuel in the fire); the three divisions of the day – forenoon, midday and evening – relating to him are his savanas; the day and night are his Darsapurnamasa sacrifices; the half months and the months are his Chaturmasya sacrifice; the seasons are his Pasubandha sacrifice; the samvatsaras and the parivatsaras are his Ahargana sacrifice; the total sacrifice is, indeed, his Sattra; death is the Avabhritha or completion of his sacrifice. That person who knows this, namely, the conduct of a Sannyasin – covering all the duties from Agnihotra to Sattra and terminating in death overcome by old age – and who dies during the period of the sun’s movement to the north attains to the overlordship of gods like Indra and then reaches identity or companionship with the sun. On the other hand he who dies during the period when the sun moves to the south gets only the greatness of the manes and then attains to the identity or companionship with the moon. A Brahmana who knows separately the greatness of the sun and the moon realizes these two; but he who has become a knower of Hiranyagarbha wins further. From that knowledge which was acquired in the world of Hiranyagarbha, he attains to the greatness of Brahman, the Supreme who is Existence-Knowledge-Bliss, at the dissolution of the world of Hiranyagarbha. Thus the secret knowledge here, and in this Upanishad, is concluded.
    Sannasya is noted as the highest means and it is also explained that Sannyasa is not mere giving up of worldly comforts or wearing of Gerua. True sannyasa is giving the self to the Self. That is why, the Gita ends with a sacred upadesha: Sarva Dharma -----. All ways enumerated above lead to the Supreme. Yet, the Upanishad distinguishes the path to Moon, the Path to Sun, and the path of knowledge of Hiranyagarbha.

    For this reason, I found your statement: "One thing I have sufficiently understood today, however, is this: the question is not one reaching the goal but the goal coming on to the individual." , as the highest understanding. This itself is knowledge.

    I think that the body and the mind being inert, it is impossible that these will reach the goal. Rather the origin, the Hiranyagarbha, draws the wayward mind in immediately provided the mind is still. All practices are towards this end.

    Om Namah Shivaya
    Last edited by atanu; 14 July 2010 at 09:26 AM.
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

  3. #13
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    Re: What is the goal of life?

    Pranam Atanu ji and all

    A story from Mahabharat comes to mind, the young princes being tested by Dronacharya, all except Arjun failed the target test. Everyone saw the target differently while Arjun’s lux or target was fixed.

    Seemingly simple question by you, brings forth a lot off complex answers, none committal, four purashartha to individual aspiration being non judgemental, all sounds very good.

    Does Vedas have a goal set, does our great Acharya like Shankra set a goal? Did Lord Shree Krishna in Gita set us a goal?

    Thanks to Saidevo ji for the quote on dharma from Upanisad.


    Lord Krishna describe this sansara as a banyan tree in chapter 15, and implores us, to cut our relation with it.

    Neither its (real) form nor its beginning, neither its end nor its existence is perceptible here on the earth. Having cut these firm roots of the Ashvattha tree by the mighty ax of (Jnana and) Vairaagya or detachment; (15.03)

    tatah padam tat parimargitavyam
    yasmin gata na nivartanti bhuyah
    tam eva cadyam purusam prapadye
    yatah pravrttih prasrta purani

    The goal should be sought reaching which one does not come back; and there surrender to that primal purusam from which this primal manifestation comes forth. (15.04)

    Shankracharya in Vivek Chudamni says so in no uncertain terms also

    1. I bow to Govinda, whose nature is Bliss Supreme, -----
    2. For all beings a human birth is difficult to obtain, more so is a male body; rarer than that is Brahmanahood; rarer still is the attachment to the path of Vedic religion; higher than this is erudition in the scriptures; discrimination between the Self and not-Self, Realisation, and continuing in a state of identity with Brahman – these come next in order. (This kind of) Mukti (Liberation) is not to be attained except through the well-earned merits of a hundred crore of births.
    3. These are three things which are rare indeed and are due to the grace of God – namely, a human birth, the longing for Liberation, and the protecting care of a perfected sage.
    4. The man who, having by some means obtained a human birth, with a male body and mastery of the Vedas to boot, is foolish enough not to exert himself for self-liberation, verily commits suicide, for he kills himself by clinging to things unreal.
    5. What greater fool is there than the man who having obtained a rare human body, and a masculine body too, neglects to achieve the real end of this life ?

    Following the Purshartha with dharma at fore sets us apart from Pashu but pursharth is a tool not a goal that is my opinion.
    Without sitting on the fence I will on my part declare that Moksha and love of God is the goal of life, although I fail in my attempts as the pull of maya is very strong and I fall down perpetually but with that goal in my mind and his/her Karuna I hope one day I will achieve that goal.

    Am I suggesting we all abandon our duty and proceed to the forest? No but when the time comes we have to give up everything including our loved ones, for whom we struggle and work very hard, therefore a wise one asks in solitude what is the purpose of life?

    That is when our spiritual journey begins, reading the scriptures listening to dharma gurus, who will only echo what’s in the Vedas towards that final goal.

    they are not Abramic in nature, idiotic or foolish, it is voluntary, as Lord Krishna says, now do as you please to Arjun. this is the nature of sanatan dharma, it is a self enquiry.

    Jai Shree Krishna
    Rig Veda list only 33 devas, they are all propitiated, worthy off our worship, all other names of gods are derivative from this 33 originals,
    Bhagvat Gita; Shree Krishna says Chapter 3.11 devan bhavayatanena te deva bhavayantu vah parasparam bhavayantah sreyah param avapsyatha Chapter 17.4 yajante sattvika devan yaksa-raksamsi rajasah pretan bhuta-ganams canye yajante tamasa janah
    The world disappears in him. He is the peaceful, the good, the one without a second.

  4. #14
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    Re: What is the goal of life?

    namaste everyone.

    I have no doubt or dispute that mokSha is the only goal of life, but I did wonder as to why dharma is equated with mokSha. Perhaps the reasons could be:

    • Dharma and Love of God are readily understood from the shaikSha sAdhaka--novice seeker, to the mumukShu--sage striving for mokSha. As against this, a shaikSha has only a vague idea of mokSha, an anubhavin--experienced, has more knowledge and less experience, and a jnAni has all knowledge and experience of it.

    • Just as even a jnAni has an exterior, an interface, to the world, mokSha has an exterior, interface, which is dharma. Dharma itself has an interface which is karma--action.

    • The interior/core of dharma is shAnta svaraikyam--peaceful harmony; of mokSha is satchidAnanda--blissfully conscious existence.

    • Dharma is cyclic, hence the dharma-chakra, through the three worlds bhu-bhuva-suvaha; mokSha is sthita-prajna--abiding in Consciousness, here and now and for ever.

    • Dharma is the trunk, branches, leaves, flowers and fruits of the tree of life; mokSha is the root. Since this root itself branches out through AkAsha--space, in all directions and forms the core experience of mokSha as AUM--the primordial sound of silence, the Tamizh poet BhArati said, "I saw vedAnta as a tree standing upside down", a tree whose foliage is on earth and the roots are in space.

    • The tree of human body has a similar make-up with its roots up at the sahasrAra chakra of the brain.

    • bhakti--devotion and love of God, is the interface between karma (which in turn is the interface to dharma) and jnAna (the interface to mokSha). We dream in the state of bhakti with brief experiences of the turIya state of jnAna, grounding ourselves in the jAgrat--wakeful, state of dharma.

    It seems that dharma and mokSha are like a pair of Siamese twins, glued together by bhakti.
    रत्नाकरधौतपदां हिमालयकिरीटिनीम् ।
    ब्रह्मराजर्षिररत्नाढ्यां वन्दे भारतमातरम् ॥

    To her whose feet are washed by the ocean, who wears the Himalayas as her crown, and is adorned with the gems of rishis and kings, to Mother India, do I bow down in respect.

    --viShNu purANam

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    Re: What is the goal of life?

    Quote Originally Posted by saidevo View Post
    namaste everyone.

    I have no doubt or dispute that mokSha is the only goal of life, but I did wonder as to why dharma is equated with mokSha. Perhaps the reasons could be:
    ---
    It seems that dharma and mokSha are like a pair of Siamese twins, glued together by bhakti.
    Namaste saidevoji

    I agree about dharma. However, I understand that the Supreme itself is every thing and is every path. But, nyAsa, the full deposition of manAsa in Brahman, named as OM is Brahman itself.

    ekonaashiititamo.anuvaakaH . MahanArayana

    --------tasmaatsatyaM parama.n vadanti .. 2., -------tasmaattapaH parama.n vadanti .. 3.., --------tasmaaddamaH parama.n vadanti .. 4.., --------tasmaachchhamaH parama.n vadanti .. 5.., --------tasmaaddaanaM parama.n vadanti .. 6.., --------tasmaaddharmaM parama.n vadanti .. 7.., ---------tasmaat prajananaM parama.n vadanti .. 8.., ----------tasmaadagniin parama.n vadanti .. 9.., ---------tasmaadagnihotraM parama.n vadanti .. 10.., -------- tasmaad yaj~naM parama.n vadanti .. 11.., ---------tasmaadmaanasaM parama.n vadanti .. 12..,


    nyaasa ityaahurmaniishhiNo brahmaaNaM brahmaa vishvaH katamaH svayambhuuH prajaapatiH sa.nvatsara iti .. 13..
    -----
    omityaatmaana.n yu~njiita . etadvai mahopanishhada.n devaanaa.n guhyam.h . ya eva.n veda brahmaNo mahimaanamaapnoti tasmaadbrahmaNo mahimaanamityupanishhat.h .. 18..
    And in this connection, in order to establish the conection to the ultimate goal, it may be appropriate to re-iterate again;


    BU IV, 4, 23. --- All that matters is to know the nature of Brahman. One who knows is untainted by evil action.

    CU VIII, 5 ------ He who departs from this world without having found the atman and true desires will lack freedom in every world.
    To rephrase, IMO, the dharma, danam, satyam, tapas, yajnam, manas, etc. are all the equal branches of the Supreme, who resides equally in all these branches. But the goal is to know the resident who resides in all these residences.

    Om Namah Shivaya
    Last edited by atanu; 15 July 2010 at 01:25 AM.
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

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    Re: What is the goal of life?

    namaste Atanu.

    I totally agree with your rephrasing, but aren't dAnam, satyam, tapas, yajnam, manas, etc., only different forms and names of dharma, just as mokSha is a different name for brahman (a name that aligns with the state)?

    Yes, the sap--rasa, of the Tree is brahman; it is amRtam--sap of immortality; and dharma, coupled with bhakti, gives us the capability to taste that sap, while jnAna ensures that our very nature is that sap.

    No doubt the goal is the jnAnam about brahman, but dharma with bhakti purifies and expands the vessel in us, so the goal of jnAnam enters and fills us with the bliss of brahman.
    रत्नाकरधौतपदां हिमालयकिरीटिनीम् ।
    ब्रह्मराजर्षिररत्नाढ्यां वन्दे भारतमातरम् ॥

    To her whose feet are washed by the ocean, who wears the Himalayas as her crown, and is adorned with the gems of rishis and kings, to Mother India, do I bow down in respect.

    --viShNu purANam

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    Re: What is the goal of life?

    Quote Originally Posted by saidevo View Post
    namaste Atanu.

    I totally agree with your rephrasing, but aren't dAnam, satyam, tapas, yajnam, manas, etc., only different forms and names of dharma, just as mokSha is a different name for brahman (a name that aligns with the state)?
    Namaste saidevoji

    (That depends on understanding again. I remind that mere sleeping, eating and copulatiing was compared to the exact destination and dharma.)

    I agree that all terms mean dharma, but, the verses cited say dharma param, danam param, tapa param, satyam param. The verse does not say satyam dharma, tapa dharma, danam dharma----.

    I hope i am able to make the point. The common intelligent substratum is the primal purusha. Shankara is very clear on this. Dharma and Karma are helpful yet not the causative of moksha (other schools differ). I argue that dharma-karma are inert and in themselves have no intelligence to bestow fruits.

    Further, Shri Krishna teaches: 'sarva dharma ------surrender to me' And while we are talking of the ultimate goal, i will like to reiterate what Ganeshprasadji cited:

    tatah padam tat parimargitavyam
    yasmin gata na nivartanti bhuyah
    tam eva cadyam purusam prapadye
    yatah pravrttih prasrta purani

    (15.04)


    No doubt the goal is the jnAnam about brahman, but dharma with bhakti purifies and expands the vessel in us, so the goal of jnAnam enters and fills us with the bliss of brahman.
    No doubt about it.

    Yet, I also believe: "One thing I have sufficiently understood today, however, is this: the question is not one reaching the goal but the goal coming on to the individual."

    On this, I resort to Shri Ramana Maharshi. He teaches that there are two freedoms to individuals. One can meditate and eventually enquire "Whence I am?" or one can simply surrender. The former path many, including me, find difficult.

    I understand that we both are saying the same thing. I just wanted to emphasise that dharma is not the common substratum but the Primal Purusha is. Yudhistir, dharmarAj, gambled and still being alligned to dharma was saved by the Lord.

    I think that you will not disagree to this slight change of the perspective.

    Regards


    Om Namah Shivaya
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

  8. #18
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    Re: What is the goal of life?

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~~


    namasté


    A 'goal' suggests the attainment of something one does not have...that is why I have suggested 'aim'. I am not inferrring my offer is superior to any other member's offer, just a different POV for the conversation.

    Here is my orientation on this matter, perhaps there is an ounce of insight in it worthy of consideration:

    We are already an expression of the Divine , our SELF resides in us - where do we need to go to get it ? to achieve it , to reach this goal?

    As I see it, if we agree to the notion of unfoldment = goal, then I think I can concur. Yet because we need a 'process' (upāya ) to unfold
    this goal one thinks we are going from here-to-there and that suggests an end; and this end is attributable to a finish line a ~goal~.

    Looking at it another way I think I can state my POV in one word - pratyabhijñā , to re-recognize , remember , know , understand ;
    to come to one's self , recover consciousness ; regaining knowledge or recognition of the identify of oneself with the Supreme. Any thing less as I see it may be an interesting attainment, but a missed opportunity none the less.

    I look to one beacon of Truth, the Śaṅkarācārya of Jyotirmath (from 1941-1953) , svāmī brahmānaṇda sarasvatī who offers these wise words:
    To get a human body is a rare thing, make use of it. There are 4 million kinds of lives which a soul ( ātman) can gather.
    After that one gets a chance to be human, to get a human body. Therefore, one should not waste this chance. Every second in human life is valuable. If you don’t value this, then you have nothing in hand and you will weep in the end.

    Because you are human, God has given you power to think and decide what is good and bad. Therefore, you can do the best possible kind of action. You should never consider yourself weak or a fallen creature.
    Whatever may have happened up till now may be because you didn't know, but now be careful... after getting a human body, if you don’t reach God, then you have sold a diamond at the price of spinach.


    praṇām
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  9. #19
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    Re: What is the goal of life?

    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post
    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~~
    namast

    A 'goal' suggests the attainment of something one does not have...---.

    Looking at it another way I think I can state my POV in one word - pratyabhijā , to re-recognize , remember , know , understand ;

    to come to one's self , recover consciousness ; regaining knowledge or recognition of the identify of oneself with the Supreme. Any thing less as I see it may be an interesting attainment, but a missed opportunity none the less.


    praṇām
    Ditto. To uncover the dross over Gold by polishing to reveal its natural state.

    Om Namah Shivaya
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

  10. #20
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    Re: What is the goal of life?

    Namaste Friends


    Brihadaraynaka U.
    III-viii-10: He, O Gargi, who in this world, without knowing this Immutable, offers oblations in the fire, performs sacrifices and undergoes austerities even for many thousand years, finds all such acts but perishable; he, O Gargi, who departs from this world without knowing this Immutable, is miserable. But he, O Gargi, who departs from this world after knowing this Immutable, is a knower of Brahman.

    All beings desire happiness always, happiness without a tinge of sorrow. At the same time everybody loves himself best. The cause for love is only happiness. So, that happiness must lie in one. Further that happiness is daily experienced by everyone in sleep, when there is no mind. To attain that natural happiness one must know oneself.

    Shri Ramana Maharshi


    The above is a very simple and compelling logic that is derived directly from Vedantic teaching such as Rishi Yajnavalkya to his wife Maitrei. This simple view is complicated by some philosophy, notably from western shores, for example, philosopher Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche or Kant. The former vehemently tried to teach (while upholding upanishads as greatest teachings as opposed to Bible etc.) that the goal of gaining utter Supremacy over all others is the ultimate goal. Nietzsche could be partially correct, since the ultimate goal of every one is to wrest control over the whimsical Prakriti. Yet that again is striving towards unadulterated happiness.

    As I understand, Vedanta gives the valuable pointer that happiness is not to be had in the limited. Unadulterated happiness cannot be had at the expense of another and also at the expense of the Universe. The most beautiful teaching of Upanishad is reflected in a series of verses in Chandogya U. that expound the meaning of Agnihotra. I cite the last three verses:


    Chandogya

    V-xxiii-1 Then, when he offers the fifth oblation, he should offer it with the Mantra ‘Svaha to Udana’; thereby Udana is satisfied.

    V-xxiii-2: Udana being satisfied, the skin is satisfied; the skin being satisfied, the air is satisfied; the air being satisfied, Akasa is satisfied; Akasa being satisfied, whatever is under the air and Akasa is satisfied. Through its satisfaction the eater himself is satisfied. (He is satisfied) also with offspring, cattle, food, lustre and the holy effulgence born of sacred wisdom.

    V-xxiv-1: If anyone, without knowing this, offers the Agnihotra, it would be just a man removing the live embers and pouring the oblation on the ashes.
    The verses are beautiful as well capable of turning a mind 180 degrees. What is this about: the skin is satisfied; the skin being satisfied, the air is satisfied; the air being satisfied, Akasa is satisfied; Akasa being satisfied, whatever is under the air and Akasa is satisfied. ...............???? The happiness of one is not derived from happiness of the surrounding, but the whole Universe is happy for the happy person (how idiotic some may say).

    IMO, it will actually be idiotic to forget the simple goal of finding the happy Self, especially when the upanishad has been revealed.

    Om Namah Shivaya
    Last edited by atanu; 18 July 2010 at 11:12 AM.
    That which is without letters (parts) is the Fourth, beyond apprehension through ordinary means, the cessation of the phenomenal world, the auspicious and the non-dual. Thus Om is certainly the Self. He who knows thus enters the Self by the Self.

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