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Thread: Mr. Hawking's view

  1. #11
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    Re: Mr. Hawking's view

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté sanjaya,

    Quote Originally Posted by sanjaya View Post
    Heh, it so happens that some of my research in the near future may involve dark matter searches. I'll let you know if we find any!
    If it can be found, you are the right person for the job...Where will you begin to look? Do you think it is quantifiable?

    Keep us informed. Oh, and if I find any I will inform you too .

    praām
    यतसà¥à¤¤à¥à¤µà¤‚ शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṠśivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  2. #12

    Re: Mr. Hawking's view

    Namaste all,

    Although I generally agree with Yajvan's POV, I think there is much to be said for science's noble, if sometimes plodding and stubborn, approach.

    I have recently been reading about supermasive black holes; there are new ideas regarding such that have sufficienct amounts of cool gas near them to be able to suck in that gas, heat it to extraordinary temperatures, and then shoot out matter in jet streams that approach the speed of light for many light years, hence making them reach far out into space. Should one of these streams of matter hit a cloud of gas, that gas will in turn heat up and began producing stars, which gives rise to galaxies. Alternatively, since some of these jet streams can conceivably continue for hundreds of millions of years, they could emit enough matter to create galaxies from scratch without needing to hit another gas cloud.

    All of these ideas are still in their infancy to my knowledge (fill me in if I'm wrong, please), but provide interesting food for thought. If such matters are the case, then the universe itself could have born out of a supermassive black hole--which of course begs the question: Where did that come from? Much more research will be needed, but in the meantime I am content to rest in the knowledge that brahman unfolded all of this out of Itself as a way to know Itself, while of course remaining well beyond being a simple primordial supermassive blackhole!

  3. #13
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    Re: Mr. Hawking's view

    I thought this view of Stephen Hawkings gives us an opportunity to evaluate it with respect to our position on the creation of the Universe and see whether the thought process in the correct direction.

    As per my understanding it might be in the correct direction.

    Love and best wishes

  4. #14
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    Re: Mr. Hawking's view

    Quote Originally Posted by Ao View Post
    Namaste all,

    Although I generally agree with Yajvan's POV, I think there is much to be said for science's noble, if sometimes plodding and stubborn, approach.

    I have recently been reading about supermasive black holes; there are new ideas regarding such that have sufficienct amounts of cool gas near them to be able to suck in that gas, heat it to extraordinary temperatures, and then shoot out matter in jet streams that approach the speed of light for many light years, hence making them reach far out into space. Should one of these streams of matter hit a cloud of gas, that gas will in turn heat up and began producing stars, which gives rise to galaxies. Alternatively, since some of these jet streams can conceivably continue for hundreds of millions of years, they could emit enough matter to create galaxies from scratch without needing to hit another gas cloud.

    All of these ideas are still in their infancy to my knowledge (fill me in if I'm wrong, please), but provide interesting food for thought. If such matters are the case, then the universe itself could have born out of a supermassive black hole--which of course begs the question: Where did that come from? Much more research will be needed, but in the meantime I am content to rest in the knowledge that brahman unfolded all of this out of Itself as a way to know Itself, while of course remaining well beyond being a simple primordial supermassive blackhole!
    Thanks AO for moving ahead on this thread. This thread gives us an opportunity to ask a few questions and see if there might be connections to the theories of creation as provided in the Sanatana Dharma.

    If we accept the big bang theory then there is a question. The big bang happened out of energy concentration. We know forces move particles or physical bodies. But what moved the energy to concentrate ?

    The answer is there in the scriptures.

    The vast endless ocean of cosmic energy and consciousness is dotted with enumerous minds (point sources) which, depending on the state they are, create the point vibration.

    Some minds have bodies and majority does not. The mind with bodies (living and non living), particularly the human can change the status of the mind but others cannot (to that extent). Mind without bodies cannot anyway change its status.

    These minds creates the vibration and keep the total cosmic energy in vibrant conditions. Possibly the dance of Shiva is a depiction of this. The turbulence in the mind creates the turbulence in the energy. That might also be the reason that mind is called subtle body and not gross body or physical particle. It is so subtle that it can move energy.

    1. This flux creates condition for concentration and thus the creation of the physical universe takes place. Thus we only contribute to the creation of universe.

    2. Again at the begining there were only 8 entities which combined together to create the different matters. Are these so called 8 entities the god particles, we are in search for ?

    3. As the different lokas are different unconnected (space, time and material) worlds, the present universe is not real but is in virtual form of other lokas. Just like dream is so real when we are in it but mithya when out of it. Then how to define this universe in terms of the permanent entities of cosmic energy and consciousness ? For that permanent world, our real universe should be mithya.

    This explains why the whole scripture focuses on the mind and how to clam it down to make the turbulence zero. Then one will not contribute to the turbulence in cosmic energy and thereby the creation. It also attains moksha in the process.

    Then another question come up. Is mind the connecting factor for the different lokas ?

    Love and best wishes

  5. #15

    Re: Mr. Hawking's view

    Quote Originally Posted by kallol View Post
    We know forces move particles or physical bodies. But what moved the energy to concentrate ?
    Here is a tiny side-bit, only meant to stimulate further discussion from those members more knowledgeable than I.

    It seems that in the early universe, heavier elements had not yet been formed, thus giving hyper-massive stars made entirely of helium, hydrogen, and lithium the chance to form. These stars, in their death-throes, gave birth through their fusion to the heavier elements that therefore precluded their re-forming, hence in the universe around us today we can only find traces of such massive stellar furnaces in dwarf galaxies. Could this be evidence of the Vedic Hiranyagarbha?

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    Re: Mr. Hawking's view

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté kallol,

    Quote Originally Posted by kallol View Post
    If we accept the big bang theory then there is a question. The big bang happened out of energy concentration. We know forces move particles or physical bodies. But what moved the energy to concentrate ?
    And where is this intelligence found in the laws of nature that directs, lays the rules, for concentration as a natural phenomenon to occur?
    This always seems to be discounted. Event A occurs and event B happens, yet there seems to be a blind-eye cast ( in science) that does not address the underlying intelligence of the physical laws to apply. If they were completely random, chaotic, then I would have no issue. Yet these laws occur consistently 100% of the time.


    Take a watermelon seed. Plant the seed. What do you get? A watermelon, not a goat, mule, or a palm tree. There is order to this universe. From where is this order ( my teacher calls creative intelligence) derived from? From this Universal Intelligence. It is at the very core of a sun's fission ( or fusion ?) process, in the galaxies rotation, in orbits, in the sent of a flower, in the path of a fish, in the lifting of brick. The rules occur consistently with precision and with order and discipline. This is the Cosmic Intelligence that is the wonder. The 'code' that is in everything to operate according to specific laws, that is the intelligence.

    praām
    यतसà¥à¤¤à¥à¤µà¤‚ शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṠśivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  7. #17
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    Re: Mr. Hawking's view

    namaste,

    Indeed. If there is code, there must be a coder.

    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post
    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~
    The 'code' that is in everything to operate according to specific laws, that is the intelligence.

    praām
    satay

  8. #18

    Re: Mr. Hawking's view

    Quote Originally Posted by satay View Post
    namaste,

    Indeed. If there is code, there must be a coder.
    Well, not necessarily an intelligent coder, but at least a process whereby a code is engaged. I think it is easy to fall into the trap of overly-simplistic language here.

  9. #19
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    Re: Mr. Hawking's view

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté Ao,

    you mention
    Well, not necessarily an intelligent coder, but at least a process whereby a code is engaged. I think it is easy to fall into the trap of overly-simplistic language here.
    I see it from a different POV. The code and coder are One. The coder has 1,000 eyes and ears and feet and hands i.e It is everywhere, it is tad-ekam, That One.
    The code is perfect because it is the coder - no flaws, no blemishes, perfection without of 1º of effort , ever.

    The word is satatoditam comes to mind . Svāmi laksman-ji offers this word from the tantrāloka. It is that which has no pause, no break.
    This for me really captures the essence of this totality, the fullness.

    Svāmi-ji says ' It is breakless and unitary. Hence the code and coder are One Being of perfect Infinite Intelligence.


    praām
    यतसà¥à¤¤à¥à¤µà¤‚ शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṠśivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  10. #20

    Re: Mr. Hawking's view

    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post
    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté Ao,

    you mention

    I see it from a different POV. The code and coder are One. The coder has 1,000 eyes and ears and feet and hands i.e It is everywhere, it is tad-ekam, That One.
    The code is perfect because it is the coder - no flaws, no blemishes, perfection without of 1º of effort , ever.

    The word is satatoditam comes to mind . Svāmi laksman-ji offers this word from the tantrāloka. It is that which has no pause, no break.
    This for me really captures the essence of this totality, the fullness.

    Svāmi-ji says ' It is breakless and unitary. Hence the code and coder are One Being of perfect Infinite Intelligence.


    praām
    Namaste Yajvan,

    I actually think we are approaching this issue from the same POV. I am simply trying to employ a more technical, exact, language to the discussion. Probably due to the kind of academic writing I sometimes use at work.

    You and I are on the same page, I believe.

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