japa

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast�


To be ~technical~ and to compliment the conversation of doing the mantra properly, let me offer the following.

ॐ महेश्वराय नमः
oṁ maheśvarāya namaḥ


Note at the end of नमः or namaḥ is 'ḥ' - this is shown in saṃskṛtam as :

So , we say nama-ḥ . This ḥ is a slight puff of air sounding like 'ha' ; it is a continuaion of the last 'a' of with mouth opened, we add the asperated 'h'.

praṇām

[Eastern Mind]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namast�


To be ~technical~ and to compliment the conversation of doing the mantra properly, let me offer the following.

महे श्वराय नमः

Note at the end of नमः or namaḥ is 'ḥ' - this is shown in saṃskṛtam as :

So , we say nama-ḥ . This ḥ is a slight puff of air sounding like 'ha' ; it is a continuaion of the last 'a' of with mouth opened, we add the asperated 'h'.

praṇām

Vannakkam Yajvan: My ear is pathetic. The 'h' you speak of is okay with the puff, but the h in blends like dharma, and bheema, of kh just gets me. I just here darma, beema, and k. There are no h blends on English as far as I know. I think you are in the minority, if you can hear all these sounds. I wonder what kind of training you may have done to enhance all this. I also wonder if, over time there are genetic factors at play in ears as related to language, as whole groups of people are unable to hear or say certain sounds. But hey, at least it is easier than doing the tranliteration, or learning the clicking language of the Kalahari bushmen.


Aum Namasivaya

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté EM ( et.al)

Vannakkam Yajvan: My ear is pathetic. The 'h' you speak of is okay with the puff, but the h in blends like dharma, and bheema, of kh just gets me. Aum Namasivaya

Let me offer the following for those listening in and perhaps to better understand this wonderful visarga (ḥ)


ॐ महेश्वराय नमः
oṁ maheśvarāya namaḥ


Regarding visarga (ḥ)
This visarga¹ is written as : in saṃskṛtam. Offically it is not part of the saṃskṛta alphabet but is part of the ~rules~ of saṃdhi¹.

The rule says it is an unvoiced breath; it is due to the adjacent sounds before it. Visarga (ḥ) comes after a vowel . It can be after other vowels ( not only 'a'), but let's use this example of namaḥ ( नमः ).
Here it is the unvoiced breath following the 'a' , air comes from the mouth as long as the mouth is open with the 'a' , there is the emission of breath, ha.

Enter the tradition - some like to 'echo' the vowel 'a' , so now it looks like this, namaḥa. Now ha is in fact a phoneme part of devanāgarī script.
The thirty-third and last consonant of our nāgarī alphabet (in pāṇini's system) belonging to the guttural class , and usually pronounced like the English h in hard.

So you see, then you would count 'ha' as a phoneme/sound. Some build mantra's with this 'ha' in it taking advantage of 'ha' sound. But who cares?
The designer of the mantra - 'ha' is a masculine form of śiva or bhairava , and feminine form some say śakti. No matter , it is auspicious and 'ha' means auspicious, heaven, it also means delight, and viṣṇu . Where do we find this 'ha' ? In a+ha + ṁ or ahaṁ.

So, one needs to see the intent of the mantra builder. Does he want you to sound 'ha' or does he wish the visarga (ḥ) with breath?


praṇām

words

• visarga - emission; sending forth , letting go . That is why is is associated with śiva , as he 'sends forth' creation from Himself.
• saṃdhi , some write sandhi - In general, containing a conjunction or transition from one to the other .
  • More specifically according to the Monier-Williams Saṃskṛt Dictionary, saṃdhi is a euphonic junction of final and initial letters in grammar

[sunyata07]

Namaste,

The unvoiced h in namah certainly takes some getting used to, doesn't it? As for the Shivaya pronunciation, I can understand what truthseeker is talking about. The "she" approximation in English is very crude. As EM was saying, if it grates on the ears or the tongue as you say it, there is a reason for that. Mental repetition (the best kind of japa) when you make obeisance to Lord Shiva need not be discounted, however!

Quick question. Does anyone know why the common form of the Shiva mantra is "Om namah Shivaya" and not the usual form where the ending is the ritual namah, as in: "Om Shivaya namah"? I have my theory that it's because all things end with Shiva, the Dissolver, but of course, that's just touching the surface of the interpretation. Maybe there's another reason for this tradition? Would love to hear what others think about this.

Om namah Shivaya

[Eastern Mind]

Vannakkam Sunyata: There are many explanations, and just as many sites on the internet to explain them all. Here is one that explains it more or less as going up the chakras (about half way down the page) http://www.newagegod.com/LAFFmedia/1minmed.htm

Still others have a variety of orders beyond these two (si va ya na ma, and na ma si va ya) . I know of no other set of 5 syllables that have been written about or discussed more in Saivism. At any moment in time, probably 100 000 souls or more are chanting it or singing it in some form.

For me personally, it is 5 separate syllables, and the one I have the most difficulty with is va, not si, as it turns into vie (long i as in strike) when followed by the y in ya. But that's just me.

Aum Namasivaya

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté sunyata,

I have my theory that it's because all things end with Shiva, the Dissolver, but of course, that's just touching the surface of the interpretation.

What you say has merit... all things begin and end with śiva.
All creation lies between a and ha. When we bring these letters together we get aha and by the rules of grammar we add 'ṁ'
and arrive at ahaṁ. This ahaṁ = I = Univeral Being = śiva . This ahaṁ is a primary mantra of śiva.


Now this visarga (ḥ) from the posts above: The word visarga is defined as emission; sending forth , letting go. This is what śiva does from
His own Being - he lets forth, sends forth all of creation. So with this sound we are sending forth the sound that just was voiced.
But you may say ' I am not śiva ' - to this I say, that is part of the waking up. Each time we voice ḥ it is to remind us who we are
iti śivaṁ - thus śiva.

ॐ महेश्वराय नमः
oṁ maheśvarāya namaḥ

praṇām

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

All creation lies between a and ha.

I thought to take the liberty and offer another idea for one's kind consideration.

śiva is sometimes known as haraḥ . Note we return back to 'ha'.
haraḥ हरः is defined as 'seizer' , 'destroyer' ; Its components are:

ha ह -_the Supreme; destroying , removing ; the sparkling of a gem
ra र - _acquiring , possessing ;brightness , splendour
ḥ - or visarga (ḥ) as we discussed from the posts above

We find this hara in another name for śiva - śaśiśekhara . Here He is called out as the bearer or holder of the moon; He is white as camphor; He is the seizer, and it is inferred that He brings soma i.e. delight. This is all called out in His name:

• śaśin - is a name for the moon, also camphor; it also infers the number one. We know śiva is called out as white as camphor, that of His purity.
• hara - is bearing or wearing; We now know this word means 'seizer', 'destroyer'
• We know śiva is shown with a moon over His head. The moon is also called soma. Here is the beauty of this word:
  The Supreme by another word is sat ( or sattā - Being, or Truth), that is, brahman. And umā is śrī devī we call pārvatī.
  Now when sa(t) comes together with umā what is created ? soma ( once again the rules of grammar apply for this addition).
  What do we call the moon? soma .

When śiva and pārvatī are joined together we get soma (delight). Hence for amāvāsya or the new moon, śiva and pārvatī come together,
are enveloped and become moon/soma/delight.

praṇām

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté

The rule says it is an unvoiced breath; it is due to the adjacent sounds before it. Visarga (ḥ) comes after a vowel .
It can be after other vowels ( not only 'a'), but let's use this example of namaḥ ( नमः ).
Here it is the unvoiced breath following the 'a' , air comes from the mouth as long as the mouth is open with the 'a' ,
there is the emission of breath, ha.

I thought to mention , and limit any confusion, that this visarga (ḥ) is a ~rule~ that is applied.

In the example above we used namaḥ नमः and so visarga (ḥ) is applied to the letter 'a'. Yet what of hariḥ ?
The rule says it is an unvoiced breath, the 'follow through' of the previous sound. In this case , it is the follow through of the letter 'i' .
So, where ever the mouth position is with this letter 'i' ( which sounds like the i in pink) we follow through with visarga and add that
puff of air in the same mouthed position. So, it may sound something like hari- he .

Hope that may have helped a bit in the apprecaition of this visarga (ḥ). These rules are called the rules of saṃdhi ( some write sandhi).

What does that mean ? saṃdhi means , placing together. Placing together sounds. When certain sounds come togetther
there are rules. Let me give you an English rule example:
He is when combined becomes he's. We can consider that a rule of grammar, and in saṃskṛt these combination rules are called saṃdhi.

Who created the rules? Most notable ( to me) is Pāṇini-ji Yāska-muni and the great śābdikin Patañjali-ji.

My interests in word-sounds focus much on nirukta or the etymology ( 'true sense') of words. The study is rooted in vāc¹ that which
is uttered , pronounced , expressed , explained , defined. This study is very attractive to me and has been for some time, yet I still consider
myself an entry level student (śiṣya) at best.

praṇām

words
vāc is recognized as bhāratī or sarasvatī , the goddess of speech. Yet she is called the mother of the vedas and wife of indra ;
At times she is the daughter of dakṣa and wife of kaśyapa

[Adhvagat]

This H discussion reminds me of when I was learning to speak english.

Do you, native english speakers know how unnatural the TH sound of THINK is to those who don't speak english? I had to bend my tongue and almost bite it off to speak it properly.

No other sound in no other language I know has this TH sound, this hybrid of S and F, this is madness!

[yajvan]

hariḥ oṁ
~~~~~~

namasté PI,

This H discussion reminds me of when I was learning to speak english.

Do you, native english speakers know how unnatural the TH sound of THINK is to those who don't speak english? I had to bend my tongue and almost bite it off to speak it properly.

No other sound in no other language I know has this TH sound, this hybrid of S and F, this is madness!

I see you may like TH? In saṃskṛtam, there is ṭa , ṭha , tha and just ta. These have fancy names of cerebral (mūrdhanya) or dental
(dantya) based upon mouth positions for vowels and consonents. There are a total of 5 mouth positions.

• ṭa ट - sounds like tub or tap some like the word start. Yet to say tub there is a hint of h in it taah-ub.
• ṭha ठ - sounds like anthill, but sounding like this : an-thill
• ta त - sounds like water.
• yet there is tha थ and it sounds like nuthook , yet sounded out like this nu-thook

I must say I have been practicing, yet still have not approched these sound forms consistently or correctly.

praṇām