To Hell And Back

[Eastern Mind]

Vannakkam all: Just for clarification, when I say there is no hell, I simply mean the Abrahamic version of some underground cave of fire where mankind faces an eternity of torture.

There are hellish states of mind, and some of us have encountered them. In fact we've discussed them on here. (the anger thread) Basically any chakra below the muladhara is a hellish or uncomfortable or adharmic state.

Also, the focus on this does vary from sect to sect, and person to person. Since I'm pretty focused on one sampradaya in this regard, one which focuses on positivity and non-duality a lot, I rarely think of hell or hellish.

Aum Namasivaya

[sm78]

Vannakkam all: Just for clarification, when I say there is no hell, I simply mean the Abrahamic version of some underground cave of fire where mankind faces an eternity of torture.

I am not so sure, for those who take such teachings to heart - hells & heavens may indeed exist somewhere, waiting to welcome them after death.

What we can conceive internally must have some source & reality in the continum of consciousness somewhere & Eternity is just a notion of scale.

It is another thing that such heaven and hell is of no consequence to most of the Hindus - I hope.

[cmorel02]

The way I think of it, if one IS good, DOES good, loves God/Goddess, and meditates, a heavenly afterlife will wait for you. People who harm and hate will suffer: hell or bad life once they are born again....But eventually everyone is born again, unless they find their way back to Brahman again.

[Sādhaka]

Namasté Sādhaka
Of course, friend! Trust your Self
There is no need to consider any Abrahamic concepts to find Divine Truth for ourselves. God exists before scripture. I have not needed to read the Vedas' in depth to confirm this (Upanishads, Gita and Agama are rewarding). The beauty of Sanatana Dharma is that the scriptures support rather than dictate. Adi Shankara does not recognise the need of the puranic scriptures (in which Hell is described), nor to my knowledge do the puranic scriptures state that Heaven and Hell are the choice for all beings - we can aim for moksha with the Lord.

Something which I hope will become clear, is that the Abrahamic scriptures do not work against the Upanishads. There is no threat or need for comparison. The question in my opinion is a big difference in vocabulary, further confused by translation and opinion (on Abrahamic scriptures).

Namaste Onkara,

As usually, beautifully put. Thanks.

OM

[PatrickMB]

I believe that Jesus talked about a permanent Hell more than any other religious prophet. And the purpose of the Christian Hell is not to instruct or uplift the soul, but rather to eternal punish for a temporal act. Personally, it's hard for me to find a loving God in that, although I don't try to change the minds of people who do.

[AstralProjectee]

Hi cmorel02, You might want to look into St. Isa. Did you know that Jesus traveled to the India learned from the sages and came back. Yes I know many do not know this. In fact there are books and video about it.

Good luck.

[Jetavan]

Probably the most extreme of the Christian theologies is Calvinism, which says that some people (the "elect") are predestined (since before Creation itself) to hell and some predestined for heaven. Calvinism is characterized by five major beliefs, or "TULIP":

Total depravity of man: Man is totally and completely sinful.
Unconditional election: God "elects" those whom He wants to save; the "unelect" are forever damned.
Limited atonement: Jesus only died for those few people who are "elected".
Irresistible grace: If God elects you, you *will* be saved.
Perseverance of the saints: Once you are saved, you will always be saved.

Obviously, many Christians view the Calvinist God as a terrorist God.

Contrary to Calvinism, is the Christian theology of Universal Salvation, which has it's own TULIP:

Total reconciliation: The power of Jesus to reconcile Man to God is total.
Unlimited atonement: Jesus died so that *all* would be saved.
LOVE: God created humanity in order to love all humanity, not just some.
Irresistible grace through the ages: God offers salvation even after death.
Perseverance of God: God never gives up in pursuing our salvation.

Needless to say, official Christian doctrines of most churches reject Universal Salvation.


Aum Namah Śivaaya