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Thread: Boxing, Kickboxing, and MMA

  1. #1
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    Boxing, Kickboxing, and MMA

    Hello and namaste,
    I was wondering what the thoughts were concerning participants in Mixed Martial Arts?
    Included with this question is the training of them only compared to the participation and viewing of them in a atmosphere that may include robust language. Thoughts on if for sport or if the discipline is pursued for purpose of the protection of people. Any thoughts would be appreciated.
    Thanks.
    Rich

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    Re: Boxing, Kickboxing, and MMA

    I have trained some kickboxing, mma and kung fu. I have a lot of respect and admiration for martial arts training, but I have stopped doing it for a few reasons.

    It's all a big joke in my opinion. If something really dangerous happens, you often cannot use these skills. You can even make the situation worse trying to fight. Some martial arts are nice to watch in the movies, but in real life you are better of trying to avoid fights. You can even go to jail if you happen to be a better fighter than your opponent. If you really are concerned about safety, maybe something like traditional Jiu Jitsu or Krav Maga could be helpful. MMA and kickboxing are ring sports and often useless outside the ring. Of course, someone who is in better physical shape has a much better change of winning any fight. There was a video of Arnold Schwarznegger stepping in a boxing match that escalated and he was totally in control of the professional boxer. Taekwando and Kung Fu as taught in the west are also big jokes in my opinion, maybe if you go to China you can find a place to learn real Kung Fu.

    I also do not consider it my svadharma to train martial arts. If I were in law enforcement, training martial arts could greatly benefit performing my dharma. But I am not, so I am not going to put in hundreds of hours learning skills I am never going to use. Also, I was kidding myself that I was training martial arts for health. This is also a big joke, because it's easy to get hurt during sparring. People have lost their teeth, broken their backs, knees and necks, just from sparring with a partner. There are others ways to stay healthy and in shape.

    I do not want to bash on martial arts. I still have a lot of respect for martial arts training. Personally, I have decided that it is not worth my time to train MMA, kickboxing, boxing or kung fu. If I ever do martial arts again, it's probably something like cardio kickboxing (for general fitness) or traditional Jiu Jitsu (for self defence). You'll have to decide for yourself.

    Just to let you know, the founder of the dvaita school of thought, Madhvacharya was also a wrestler and a weightlifter. It shows that martial arts training is not totally incompatible with a spiritual/ religious lifestyle. India also has its fair share of martial arts which are unfortunately not taught in the west: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_martial_arts
    Last edited by Sahasranama; 24 May 2011 at 07:36 AM.

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    Re: Boxing, Kickboxing, and MMA

    Vannakkam: I remember back in the late 80s when wrestling was at it's peak, and the subsequent quelling of violence we teachers had to do practically on a daily basis because of it. We teachers saw the negative influence more than most.

    I find the portrayal of loving sexuality on television far less offensive than violence, but the TV execs who are mostly Abrahamics, don't.

    The Abrahamics see violence as okay, certainly there is no real concept like the ahimsa in Hinduism. So I see it (as portrayed in the west today) mostly as an extension of Abrahamic (Who cares about the other guy?) thinking.

    Of course real martial arts from an Asiatic perspective is about self-defense, inner physical training, and lots of worthy ideas. But when power is put into the wrong hands (those who are not spiritually ready) then we see these deplorable outcomes like MMA today.

    Aum Namasivaya

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    Re: Boxing, Kickboxing, and MMA

    In my opinion, if you are going to do martial arts, you'll have to do it from a female perspective. Women make better decisions when it comes to martial arts training. Men in general are often driven by their ego and want to act macho. (not always true though)
    Last edited by Sahasranama; 24 May 2011 at 09:09 AM.

  5. #5

    Re: Boxing, Kickboxing, and MMA

    Having been Law Enforcement and exposed to many different arts when I was young, I have to say.....

    Almost all U.S. "MMA" is a joke. It is nothing but aggression and contest. Nearly none of the techniques in the primary focus of today's students have anything to do with ending a fight or protection.

    If you have the opportunity to participate in Aikido or a good Tai Chi (the fighting art - not the breathing art it's usually presented as in the West) I would definitely suggest you try it.

    Aikido, especially, is very beautiful. It isn't very popular as there aren't equivalents to "sparring" or competitions. The levels of respect and understanding are unparalleled in any other fighting art - and it's resolution to most situations result in avoiding serious injury to either party.

    Tai Chi is more of an internal focus with external impact.

    Judo and Jiu-Jitsu are a lot of fun, but often techniques that result in serious injury are the focus in addition to aggressive competition. If this is your interest, I suggest going to Aikido.

    Capoeira is fun if you can find a group that is not interested in "fighting" but rather playing, overcoming challenge and exercise.

    Western influenced Tae Kwon Do will probably not help you protect anyone and is quite impractical. Teachings usually include aggressive competition and "showy" exhibitions.

    In my opinion, many of the arts aren't really "compatible" with Western bodies - most westerners are already pre-disposed to lower back and knee injuries. Muscle and ligament tears are common because of Western sitting habits and static exercises.

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    Re: Boxing, Kickboxing, and MMA

    Namaste and thanks for the responses so far. Awhile back Pietro shared some things that offered insight regarding these issues. In considering things further had the questions I posted. Definetly agree with comment regarding Aikido and at least pertaining to me, Western bodies (LOL).
    If duty is to protect, continuing with boxing and kick boxing and some forms of martial arts such as Bando and Aikido (really compatible huh?) could be justified to some due to duty and being pure in mind about it. But if doing this, one interacts with others and assists them who may have different agendas and who participate in boxing and kickboxing matches (ring girls, cursing, sometimes alcohol, brain damage for sport) or MMA matches (ring girls, cursing, and brutality permitted by slow referees, etc.) would one who is participating for duty be complicit? These are issues now that exist with changing point of worldview.
    I apologize if not articulating well and please do not hesitate to correct me on how I am seeing issues. I will learn from the responses.
    Thanks.

  7. #7

    Re: Boxing, Kickboxing, and MMA

    Aikido works great for Western bodies - many of the stretches are dynamic, posture and breathing are key, etc, etc.

    Bando is actually not a very good comparison to Aikido...

    While Bando is considered a "defensive art," the defense comes in the offense. Techniques involve strikes intended to severely injure. The result of using Bando is that someone is likely to be left severely injured.

    Aikido intent is to break the line of attack, reduce the power of an attack, set the opponent off balance and even restrain peacefully. It is a solution of compassion.

    I'm a little confused on the final point - are you asking if that by participating in the training or association of individuals that intend to fight and injure (rather than protect) then by proxy the dutiful individual is accepting the karma of the aggressive fighters?

    There are many teachers that I have met over the years that will simply refuse students that they believe are looking for leverage to injure or intimidate people. In that aspect, then yes, I think they are avoiding the karma by association.

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    Re: Boxing, Kickboxing, and MMA

    Greetings Water and namaste. Thanks for taking this issue on. Threw out first part of issue to see what could learn. At peace with this after some dialogue with Pietro on another thread awhile back. Took some time off the forum and devoted self more to puja and dharana and studies. With this came whole host of things never considered before. Do not regret this at all. Seems like just part of the learning and growing.
    You have my second issue down very close. You understood well considering how I articulated the issue. As an aside, I was being facetious regarding participation with Aikido and Bando being compatible at face value. Sorry about that.

    At best as I can couch this: From a SD perspective, can my training and assisting others in activities that include preparaton to do physical harm for sport (very nice people. In 30 years bullies do not last where I go) in venues that are not wholesome, adversely impact them? Meaning if I'm straight in my agenda, can I still cause harm to others by helping them? Can my behavior in anyway assist them in moving further away from their life purpose of moksha?
    Thanks very much.
    Rich

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    Re: Boxing, Kickboxing, and MMA

    Boxing, kickboxing, BJJ, greco-roman wrestling and mma are not really martial arts, but sports. These sports are great for in the ring, but have a lot of flaws when used in real combat. Tai Chi is not effective at all in a street situation, it's more a form of meditation. Kung Fu and Taekwando are all flashy moves, great for fight choreography in movies. Capoeira is more a form dance, not a real martial art either. The best (non weapon) martial arts that are taught in the west are, traditional Japanese Jujitsu and Muay Thai. If you are serious about doing "martial arts" and not just something for sports, meditation, fitness, these are the ones you should look at.

    I have practiced different martial arts the past few years, I have not commited myself to any so far. If I look at the martial arts from India, I wish they were taught in the west. They are far superior than the nonsense that is taught in many dojos. Indian martial artists have superior strength and agility, for example look at the mallakamba used by the Indian wrestlers or at the people practicing kalari payattu.
    Last edited by Sahasranama; 26 May 2011 at 09:14 PM.

  10. #10

    Re: Boxing, Kickboxing, and MMA

    Namaste,

    I've trained Jiu-jitsu and wrestling but since my Diksha on my focus is in my Sadhana. It's not to say that wrestling doesn't get my interest anymore but it is not a priority.

    I may say wrestling was a part of the way divinity used to manifest itself through my body in the past but now sadhana has shown it's a more accurate way.

    Rudra sadhaka

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