Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 18

Thread: Mantra /Sanskrit Question "Ya" after Diety's name

  1. #1

    Mantra /Sanskrit Question "Ya" after Diety's name

    In mantras why is there a "ya" and the end of the Deities name like

    Om Sri Ganesha ya Namaha
    Om Namah Shiva ya
    Om Namo Narayana ya

    Thanks

  2. #2
    Join Date
    September 2006
    Age
    69
    Posts
    7,705
    Rep Power
    218

    Re: Mantra /Sanskrit Question "Ya" after Diety's name

    hari o
    ~~~~~~

    namast SBS108

    Quote Originally Posted by SBS108 View Post
    In mantras why is there a "ya" and the end of the Deities name like

    Om Sri Ganesha ya Namaha
    Om Namah Shiva ya
    Om Namo Narayana ya
    There are a few reasons. First 'ya' can meaning joining or attaining. So 'ya' is a favorable sound. It also assists in rounding out the number of phonemes ( sound syllables ) to the mantra that make it overall a positive influence. The number of syllables is of great import as to its influence from a jyotish point of view.

    oṁ namo nārāyaṇaya - ॐ नमो नारायणय
    Let's count the syllables (phonemes or akṣara)

    o__na-mo__ nā-rā-ya-a-ya
    _1___2 - 3 __ _4- 5- 6 -7 - 8


    praṇām

    words
    akṣara - a syllable , a sound. This word also means imperishable .
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  3. #3
    Join Date
    June 2011
    Location
    NJ, USA
    Age
    64
    Posts
    1,674
    Rep Power
    1689

    Re: Mantra /Sanskrit Question "Ya" after Diety's name

    First 'ya' can meaning joining or attaining.

    That's a a good way of putting it.

    Being more boring (unless you're a linguistics geek like me who gets thrills out of this stuff ) it's also the grammatical dative case meaning "to". The masculine is -ya; feminine is -yai for names ending in a.

    Shiva = Shivaya = "to Shiva" (masculine a- stem adds -ya)
    Durga = Durgayai = "to Durga" (feminine a- stem adds -yai)
    Ganesha = Ganeshaya = "to Ganesha"
    Krishna = Krishnaya = "to Krishna"

    Ganapathi = Ganapathaye = "to Ganapathi" (i- stems drop the i- and adds the -aye for masculine)
    Saraswati = Saraswatyai = "to Saraswati" (i- stems drop the i- and adds the -yai for feminine)
    Lakshmi = Lakshmyai = "to Lakshmi" (feminine i- stem)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanskrit_grammar#a-stems

    See the row for Dative.

    All nouns, pronouns, and adjectives are declined and verbs inflected this way. This makes the richness and nuances of Sanskrit, and the reason things don't translate well into English. English has almost none of this richness and conciseness.
    śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

  4. #4
    Join Date
    December 2007
    Age
    60
    Posts
    3,218
    Rep Power
    4723

    Re: Mantra /Sanskrit Question "Ya" after Diety's name

    Namaste SBS & Yajvan,

    Quote Originally Posted by SBS108 View Post
    In mantras why is there a "ya" and the end of the Deities name like

    Om Sri Ganesha ya Namaha
    Om Namah Shiva ya
    Om Namo Narayana ya

    Thanks
    Yajvan ji has given interesting answer to your query and that shows his strength in Jyotish. I shall speak from grammar point of view :

    OM Namah Shivaya : Here Shivaya means "for Shiva".

    There are eight Kaaraks to take care of the words like "in, of, for, hey, to etc." which are taken care of by vibhaktis used with the nouns/pronouns in Sanskrit.

    1)The first Vibhkati is used when the word is used as subject or noun without any kaarak.
    2) The second vibhakti is used when the the action is being done on the subject
    3) The third vibhakti is used when the action is being performed by subject
    4) The fourth vibhakti is used when action is done for the subject

    etc.

    When we do "namaskaar" (Namah in Sanskrit) then it is dome for the subject. In the above subject Shiva is the subject for whom namaskaar is being performed. Therefore Shiva is used with fourth vibhakti. As Shiva is a noun,Pullinga , singular number ending with sound "a" so, this vibhakti will be "ya" as in case of "Baalak" or "Gaja" etc. Let's notice that we don't use "ya" with female goddesses ... Om Kaalikaayai namah or Namo devyai etc.

    OM
    "Om Namo Bhagvate Vaasudevaye"

  5. #5
    Join Date
    September 2006
    Age
    69
    Posts
    7,705
    Rep Power
    218

    Re: Mantra /Sanskrit Question "Ya" after Diety's name

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté


    Some excellent insights have been offered above by devotee and Touched-by-the-Lord

    If I may ( without going too deep) let me add a few notions and always look for additional insights and/or corrections.
    • ya - is considered mascline gender; it has a relationship with yad ' who , which , what '
    • yā - is considered feminine gender¹ and in fact is a name for lakṣmī ( note the long ī at the end of the name)
    If I said śivā this is feminine and tells me it is śiva's wife (also śivī) and we're now talking śrī devī. We find the long ī consistent in the feminine devatā e.g. mahādevī , māheśvarī, mahākāmeśamahiṣī, īśvarī, etc.

    On another note - I do find yā (vs. ya) in the names of female devatā; let me offer a few for one's kind consideration:
    • manuvidyā - is identified with durgā-ma
    • turyā - She that is identical with turya (Some spell turīya)
    • hṛdyā - She who resides in the heart ( heart is code name for pure awareness)
    Perhaps we at some future date re-visit all the rules of grammar and take some practice with them. I too continue to learn , not considering my-self any more then the śiya.

    praṇām


    words
    Gender - these characteristics/marks are called puṃ-liṅga , strī -liṅga and napuṃsaka-liṅga:
    • puṃ-liṅga - puṃ = puṃs is a masculine word but also defined as a man , a male being , a human being ; it looses its 's' before a consonant in this case 'la' in liṅga.
    • strī -liṅga strī is defined as the the feminine gender yet also is defined as the 'bearer of children'; the word is also found as strīm and strīs - a woman , female , wife
    • napuṃsaka-liṅga - napuṃsaka is na +puṃ+saka : na = not or no + puṃ = male being + saka ='he that man , she that woman '
      Hence napuṃsaka means not male being or woman. It seems for economy this word could just be nasaka ( my contrived word) - not man or woman.
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  6. #6
    Join Date
    August 2006
    Age
    69
    Posts
    3,162
    Rep Power
    1910

    Re: Mantra /Sanskrit Question "Ya" after Diety's name

    namaste Devotee and others.

    A small correction to your post #4. The fourth (dative) case is 'to', rather than 'for', although 'to' and 'for' are used interchangeably. This is because, saying 'I do namaskAram for Shiva' could also mean 'I do (this) namaskAram (to someone else) for (the sake of) Shiva'; whereas saying 'I do namaskAram to Shiva' has no such ambiguity of meaning.

    Tamizh grammar which is much similar to that of Sanskrit, teaches us a formula to remember the eight cases easily: peyar--ai--All--ku--il--adhu--kaN--viLhi, that is, name--direct object--by/with--to/for--from/out of==of/'s--in/on/at--calling/hey!.

    Thus, example sentences of the eight different cases could be (In these examples, Rama is a boy, not the God):

    01. rAmaH gachChati: Rama goes.
    02. gajaH rAmaM pashyati: The elephant sees Rama.
    03. nRupaH rAmeNa gachChati: The king goes with Rama.
    04. nRupaH rAmAya phalaM yachChati: The king gives the fruit to Rama.
    05. phalaM rAmAt patati: The fruit fell down from Rama. (say from his pocket).
    06. nRupaH rAmasya grAmaM gachChati: The kings goes to Rama's village.
    07. rAmaH grAme mandaM aTati: Rama wanders slowly in the village.
    08. he rAmaH: O (Hey) Rama!
    रत्नाकरधौतपदां हिमालयकिरीटिनीम् ।
    ब्रह्मराजर्षिररत्नाढ्यां वन्दे भारतमातरम् ॥

    To her whose feet are washed by the ocean, who wears the Himalayas as her crown, and is adorned with the gems of rishis and kings, to Mother India, do I bow down in respect.

    --viShNu purANam

  7. #7
    Join Date
    December 2007
    Age
    60
    Posts
    3,218
    Rep Power
    4723

    Re: Mantra /Sanskrit Question "Ya" after Diety's name

    Namaste Saidevoji,

    Quote Originally Posted by saidevo View Post
    namaste Devotee and others.

    A small correction to your post #4. The fourth (dative) case is 'to', rather than 'for', although 'to' and 'for' are used interchangeably. This is because, saying 'I do namaskAram for Shiva' could also mean 'I do (this) namaskAram (to someone else) for (the sake of) Shiva'; whereas saying 'I do namaskAram to Shiva' has no such ambiguity of meaning.

    Tamizh grammar which is much similar to that of Sanskrit, teaches us a formula to remember the eight cases easily: peyar--ai--All--ku--il--adhu--kaN--viLhi, that is, name--direct object--by/with--to/for--from/out of==of/'s--in/on/at--calling/hey!.

    Thus, example sentences of the eight different cases could be (In these examples, Rama is a boy, not the God):

    01. rAmaH gachChati: Rama goes.
    02. gajaH rAmaM pashyati: The elephant sees Rama.
    03. nRupaH rAmeNa gachChati: The king goes with Rama.
    04. nRupaH rAmAya phalaM yachChati: The king gives the fruit to Rama.
    05. phalaM rAmAt patati: The fruit fell down from Rama. (say from his pocket).
    06. nRupaH rAmasya grAmaM gachChati: The kings goes to Rama's village.
    07. rAmaH grAme mandaM aTati: Rama wanders slowly in the village.
    08. he rAmaH: O (Hey) Rama!
    Thanks for taking pains to explain all this. Actually, the fourth vibhakti is used when something is being done "for a person" and not "to the person". When it is done to a person then the case is "Karma" i.e. the second vibhakti. When it is for the person then the case is "Sampradaan" and the vibhakti is the fourth.

    However, the use of "to" or "for" doesn't not follow the same logic in English/Tamil/Hindi that it follows in Sanskrit and that is why the confusion. You are right that "in this case" it gives a clear meaning if "to" instead of "for" is used. Particularly, this problem is seen when used in in kriyas (actions) like "give" and "namah".

    Similarly, there is problem in "Karma" i.e. second vibhakti too where "to" may or may not be there. Translation always has some serious limitations.

    OM

    The problem is not in Sanskrit. The problem is because we are seeing it from perspective of other language which is not Sanskrit e.g. English, Tamil or Hindi.
    "Om Namo Bhagvate Vaasudevaye"

  8. #8
    Join Date
    September 2006
    Age
    69
    Posts
    7,705
    Rep Power
    218

    Re: Mantra /Sanskrit Question "Ya" after Diety's name

    hari o
    ~~~~~~

    namasté saidevo, devotee

    Can you gentlemen consider starting a new string and discuss various parts of applying and identifying vibhakti ( some write sup-vibhakti) ? Examples with their case endings of eka-vacana, dvi-vacana and bahu-vacana would be helpful. Perhaps with the use of liṅga (gender) will be meaningful as it is applied correctly.

    What would be helpful is identifying the noun case endings (sup-vibhakti) that align properly with the relationship to the verb.
    Perhaps starting with the first 3 ?

    prathamā - usually names the subject of a simple sentence
    dvitīyā - destination of an action ( expressed by a verb)
    tṛtīyā - the 'instrument' i.e. by means of which an action is accomplished.

    Say we use the form of naraḥ and we're talking eka-vacana form, then:
    prathamā - naraḥ ( man)
    dvitīyā - naram (men)
    tṛtīyā - nareṇa ( eṇa is due to saṁdhi rule , of which ena is the generic form)


    Maybe starting off simple, then going to more robust examples my be of value to the HDF reader.

    thank you,

    praṇām
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  9. #9
    Join Date
    September 2006
    Age
    69
    Posts
    7,705
    Rep Power
    218

    Re: Mantra /Sanskrit Question "Ya" after Diety's name

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté
    Quote Originally Posted by saidevo View Post
    namaste Devotee and others.

    A small correction to your post #4.
    Tamizh grammar which is much similar to that of Sanskrit, teaches us a formula to remember the eight cases easily: peyar--ai--All--ku--il--adhu--kaN--viLhi, that is, name--direct object--by/with--to/for--from/out of==of/'s--in/on/at--calling/hey!.

    Thus, example sentences of the eight different cases could be (In these examples, Rama is a boy, not the God):

    01. rAmaH gachChati: Rama goes.
    02. gajaH rAmaM pashyati: The elephant sees Rama.
    03. nRupaH rAmeNa gachChati: The king goes with Rama.
    04. nRupaH rAmAya phalaM yachChati: The king gives the fruit to Rama.
    05. phalaM rAmAt patati: The fruit fell down from Rama. (say from his pocket).
    06. nRupaH rAmasya grAmaM gachChati: The kings goes to Rama's village.
    07. rAmaH grAme mandaM aTati: Rama wanders slowly in the village.
    08. he rAmaH: O (Hey) Rama!
    I thought to just help the reader a bit on the 8th case called out here.
    The 8th case is called sambodhana. Many contend saṃskṛt only has 7 cases, yet an 8th case is recognized. Sambodhana means awaking , arousing , calling. If I said Oh, Lord, this would be an example. Just as saidevo uses the term above he rAmaH: O (Hey) Rama!.

    It is taught that sambodhana is simply a special use or application of the 1st case, prathamā and is sometimes called sambodhana-prathamā. Perfectly clear ,eh?

    Perhaps saidevo-jī and devotee-jī will lead us in a discussion on the use of these ideas found in saṃskṛt.

    praṇām
    Last edited by yajvan; 05 October 2011 at 12:29 PM.
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  10. #10
    Join Date
    September 2006
    Age
    69
    Posts
    7,705
    Rep Power
    218

    Re: Mantra /Sanskrit Question "Ya" after Diety's name

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté devotee,

    Quote Originally Posted by devotee View Post

    Thanks for taking pains to explain all this. Actually, the fourth vibhakti is used when something is being done "for a person" and not "to the person".
    When we're talking of caturthī vibhakti ( the 4th case) could we not say it indicates the beneficary or purpose of the action ( verb) ?
    Lets take an English example :
    He gives food to the beggar
    He makes a bed for the beggar

    In each example to and for is used, but the idea here is the recipient of the benefit.

    Hence as you have written
    OM Namah Shivaya : Here Shivaya means "for Shiva".
    This śivaya tell us, f
    or ( the benefit or recipient) śiva . If we go one more step ( from a previous post above)

    ya - is considered mascline gender; it has a relationship with yad ' who , which , what '

    So 'ya' in this example of śivaya answers the question of 'who' which = śiva.


    You mention
    "Karma" i.e. the second vibhakti
    I understand it to be dvitīyā - destination of an action ( expressed by a verb).

    Please correct my errors in understanding.

    praṇām
    Last edited by yajvan; 05 October 2011 at 01:22 PM.
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. An exposition on the Maha Mritunjaya Mantra
    By Agnideva in forum Shaiva
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 26 September 2014, 11:22 PM
  2. Replies: 4
    Last Post: 08 February 2011, 07:06 PM
  3. Nilakantha
    By Agnideva in forum Puranas
    Replies: 36
    Last Post: 11 May 2009, 10:22 PM
  4. Cundi Baghavati
    By shian in forum Buddhism
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 31 May 2008, 01:29 AM
  5. Sanatana Dharma for Kids: Sacred Symbols: AUM
    By saidevo in forum God in Hindu Dharma
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 22 August 2006, 05:45 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •