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Thread: slavery in Abrahamic religions

  1. #31
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    Re: slavery in Abrahamic religions

    Quote Originally Posted by cuddledkitty View Post
    Ants enslave ants, Lions by definition enslave lioness into submission by killing their children, so yes it happens in nature but im only offering a dual perspective.
    Should not human behave better than ants and lions ?

    The religious aspects vary of course but the Bible and Qur'an do not ban it. I am not being bias here stating "Naturalism" or Natural Order as my supreme reasoning. But i simply just do not find an issue with slavery. My mother was a slave and she was Indonesian and was a child soldier in Saudi Arabia years ago and i am not bias towards the philosophy that supports slavery.
    Did you ask your mother how she felt when she was treated like a slave ? Bible and Q'uran may not ban it and Q'uran also permits having illegal sex with one's female slave (whether she desires it or not) ... but what will you choose ? The Bible, the Q'uran which endorse this or the SanAtan Dharma which tells you to treat everyone equally as there is God in everyone's heart ?

    It is you to decide.

    OM
    "Om Namo Bhagvate Vaasudevaye"

  2. #32
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    Re: slavery in Abrahamic religions

    Quote Originally Posted by cuddledkitty View Post
    Prophet Muhammad freed over 30,000 slaves according to Sura i may add, he declared it to be one of the highest acts of holiness. And yes i consider Muhammad to be a prophet and yes i still read the Quran, although i put the Vedas above all others
    Lol ,//Muhammad freed over 30,000 slaves according to Sura // which Sura?
    He encouraged Slavery that is the fact. You want Bukari Hadith to prove my statement. //yes i still read the Quran// that is why you are saying Slavery is normal , See How Quran changed your Mind . Sure it is from God.

  3. #33
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    Re: slavery in Abrahamic religions

    Quote Originally Posted by devotee View Post
    Should not human behave better than ants and lions ?



    Did you ask your mother how she felt when she was treated like a slave ? Bible and Q'uran may not ban it and Q'uran also permits having illegal sex with one's female slave (whether she desires it or not) ... but what will you choose ? The Bible, the Q'uran which endorse this or the SanAtan Dharma which tells you to treat everyone equally as there is God in everyone's heart ?

    It is you to decide.

    OM
    Well personally i believe in a old law stating what is yours is yours. What you conquer is what belongs to you. This is a basic rule of war and war is not with honor and i find slavery in this condition acceptable whether liked or not simply because people are humans and humans sadly dont consider each other equal nor do i especially in my case if i ever told you my life you would understand this but its long and to pitiful to be put on this forum. My mother's Parents were Indonesian/Indian and Egyptian and at that time and still today Indonesia has been trafficking non muslims to Saudi Arabia and many years ago my mother was that result and trafficked for the purposes of proxy wars. Wars fought indirectly by third parties, incase you dontknow India is the world highest mercenary and private military exporter next to Vietnam, Only China signed the UNMC banning child soldiers and private militaries but no asian country including Japan has signed this agreement. My mother became trapped in this game and my father met her in Egypt etc etc etc and the rest is history......
    So my view on this is that my mother was a target of racism and hatred and that alone. My parents and 3 sisters are dead and my mother hated me and anyone person which showed love or compassion and she spent the rest of her lives making me her enemy and anyone that got in her way so the only way i knew of this is by my father and big brother.
    Take note that of all religions Hinduism permits slavery the most, incase you dont recall the untouchables. Slaves by debt or war which is something i fully approve and the only circumstance of slavery i find justifiable. So please be aware India and its association with Hinduism puts no Hindu in a position to speak against slavery
    [CENTER] "Although the effulgence of the moon is brilliant initially at night, in the daytime it fades away. Similarly, although the lotus is beautiful during the daytime, at night it closes. But, O My friend, the face of My most dear Srimati Radharani is always bright and beautiful, both day and night. Therefore, to what can Her face be compared?" Vidagdha Madhava 5:20

  4. #34
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    Re: slavery in Abrahamic religions

    Quote Originally Posted by cuddledkitty View Post
    So please be aware India and its association with Hinduism puts no Hindu in a position to speak against slavery


    So, because there was slavery in the past, we should accept it now?

    Can you think independently for yourself or will you be a prisoner of your past/holy book, etc?

    What exactly is your agenda here on HDF, cuddledkitty?

  5. #35
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    Re: slavery in Abrahamic religions

    Quote Originally Posted by cuddledkitty View Post
    incase you dontknow India is the world highest mercenary and private military exporter next to Vietnam
    This is a very surprising news ! What is the source ? Have you seen any news where Indians have been caught as mercenaries ? I hope you are not mistaking India with Pakistan.

    Take note that of all religions Hinduism permits slavery the most, incase you dont recall the untouchables. Slaves by debt or war which is something i fully approve and the only circumstance of slavery i find justifiable. So please be aware India and its association with Hinduism puts no Hindu in a position to speak against slavery
    Aren't we talking of spirituality here ? Untouchability is not endorsed either by the Hindu scriptures or by Hindu saints or by the various sects within Hinduism. Moreover, even untouchables are just that ... they are not slaves.

    Please talk to any Hindu worth his name. He won't endorse slavery. I won't say that it was not there in some form or the other in the past ... but that is a political history and not spiritual endorsement of slavery system. Slavery is a crime against humanity and it has no justification whatsoever in whatever form.

    You are free to believe in what you want ... you don't need Hindu endorsement to all your views.

    OM
    "Om Namo Bhagvate Vaasudevaye"

  6. #36
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    Re: slavery in Abrahamic religions

    cuddledkitty, IMHO, life and soul is priceless, no one can have right over others freedom at any sort of circumstances.
    If hinduism allows it, then for sure hindusim SUCKS!!, but do you have any sources to backup your statement that hinduism allows slavery? sources by i mean scriptures and not any historic events.

    2 cents once again

  7. #37

    Re: slavery in Abrahamic religions

    Quote Originally Posted by wundermonk View Post



    What exactly is your agenda here on HDF, cuddledkitty?
    The agenda is just to stir up trouble. I don't mind trolls but cuddledkitty has to be one of the most dull. Why go into so much detail about the submission in your marriage?

    "LOL i dont like Christian preachers especially American ones. But i understand your a loser most likely, but its no joke that Catholicism breaks every biblical rule. jesus is the only priest and the Church as the Church is the people not a organization making money. Jesus is the savoir and the mediator, meaning we say in Jesus's name. What is said was a bit off but it was my bed time anyways. Be sure you know the book not the doctrine as the doctrine is a failure written by men outside of the biblical text, same applies for all faiths even Sanatana Dharma"
    *tut tut tut* Sounds like a Jesusfreak with too much time on their hands.


    I've been lurking for here a while and will post a proper introduction as soon as I have more time.

  8. #38
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    Re: slavery in Abrahamic religions

    hari o
    ~~~~~~

    namasté

    Quote Originally Posted by cuddledkitty View Post
    Well personally i believe in a old law stating what is yours is yours. What you conquer is what belongs to you.
    ...what do we really own ? This is from a post from the past.

    Looking to the maitreya upaniṣad we find the following wisdom. King Brihadratha decided to go to the forest for sanyas. He prepares his son for the kingdom, and then retires to the forest. Upon doing tapas for some time, the sage Sakayanya muni comes to him ( like a fire without smoke as the story goes). This muni departs the wisdom of Lord Maitreya, the same way as it was given to Sakayanya from the Lord, and that is the knowledge of the SELF.

    He explains the SELF, as pure, unbounded and free from states , pure, steadfast, immutable, untarnished, uneager, desire-less, subtle, invisible, non-object, unpossessive, free from states, non-agent, (but) abides like an agent.
    The muni also describes the self (of the relative field of life) , that is attached to fruit of actions, white and dark as he calls it 'good and bad' for lack of a better term. Sakayanya says, "Borne along and defiled by the stream of qualities, unsteady, wavering, bewildered, full of desire, distracted, one goes on into the state of self-conceit in thinking, 'This is I' and 'That is mine' one binds himself with himself , as does a bird with a snare."

    This notion of 'that being mine' is a distraction of the small self. When we think about it, What can you say you really own? We look to this world and it is made up of the 5 tattva's ( earth, air, fire, water and space). Where have we created any of these elements to say we possess the right to call them our own?

    But one says, I pay for the water (apa) tattva that runs to my home, do I not own it? Or the fire that comes from my stove, is it not mine?
    Aren't we really paying for a service to use these elements for a time while they're in our mists?

    But what of a car? All the tattva's are in an auto. But isn't it 'mine' ? I paid for it? All of these elements come from our good earth, and that has come from our sun. And our sun they say is perhaps a 4 th to 7th generation sun that collected all these elements from past sun's that exploded. All these things come together to offer us the car, water, gas, the shoes we wear, the body we have. All of this has been in the making for billions of years out there in akasha, in space. Where have we created one atom in our contribution of this Universe?

    So, how does one look at this? Do we say, I will keep my door open and people can come in and take my chair, it doesn’t matter - its not mine.

    This is not what I am advocating. My notion is the following:
    • These things we possess are useful and allows us a comfortable life - that is a blessing to be counted.
    • While these things are in our 'possession' it is my humble opinion we should act as stewards and keep these things in good order.
    • Where we can help others with the application of possessions, the best we can, this makes good common sense.
    • In the final analysis, all that we touch and come into contact is, itself, an expression of the Supreme and one being mindful of this, is considered wise.
    praām
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

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