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Thread: God and natural evil.

  1. #1

    God and natural evil.

    Hello forum members

    Why do you think God allows natural evil?

    I know we have karma for our actions, but why do things like Earthquakes happen to large amounts of unrelated people for example?

    I look forward to the answers.

  2. #2
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    Re: God and natural evil.

    Vannakkm Rudy: I don't think so, but that's just me. An earthquake is just nature's (some might call it God's) way. Certainly not evil. I'm reminded how doctors think they are saving lives, when in reality they are just extending lives, and singular lives at that, not the entire spectrum of many lifetimes at all.

    Aum Namasivaya

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    Re: God and natural evil.

    Namaste,

    I agree with EM. Everything that happens in the universe happens due to the cyclical nature of the existence of the universe. It is not always due to our Karma. The life of the earth is limited. The life of the Sun is limited. It is all by the laws of Nature. So, when the earth/sun goes towards its death ... it is not due to our Karma but the destiny of the universe. Death is not bad or good as you may think of, as EM has rightly pointed out. Your life is an extremely tiny fraction of our eternal existence and yet we are so attached to it ! Think outside the box. Why dying is always thought of bad ? Dying is nothing but leaving your body ... that is all. You were without a body before you were born and you will be without it after you die ... this body is only a temporary abode of the Jeeva. The body is destined to be destroyed. Why lament the destruction of something which is destined to be destroyed ???

    OM
    "Om Namo Bhagvate Vaasudevaye"

  4. #4

    Re: God and natural evil.

    Dear Friend,

    In order to understand the working principle of His leela, lets make a humble attempt....

    Consider the following example....

    Around 800 years back, many muslims invaders from the middle east invaded the holy land of Bharatha [India]....they were not only brutal and cruel, but
    also had absolutely no humanitarian values.....one kingdom waging a war against another is nothing new AND is not wrong when done for a particular purpose...
    Also, by dharma its the DUTY of the winning king to look after the people of the lost kingdom....

    but when the muslim invaders won the battles, they brutally killed the innocent people, literally destroyed each and every home, temple, building that came in their way...

    many many people saw their homes and temples getting destroyed in front of their eyes before loosing their own life under the hands of those cruel invaders....
    [Even today there are many many historical sites where the destroyed temples are still present...]

    so, the "karma"[action] under "Adharma" performed by those kings and thousands of their soldiers : "Total destruction of homes, properties and lives"


    The laws of dharma are very very simple.....for every type of karma there exists a phala....based on the type of karma, some of these phalas are immediately obtained, some of
    them after a time period....[lets not get into the details of the time difference here...]


    now..coming to the "earthquake scenario" you have mentioned, what actually happens...

    many many people, who are grouped together at some particular location, see their homes getting destroyed completely, in front of their own eyes, before loosing their own lives....
    Result: "Total destruction of homes, properties and lives"


    now lets do some analysis...the "Total destruction of homes, properties and lives" is the result of earth quake....so, if we look at only this part of the story, we see no logic at all...nature and its Creator appear like villains doing adharma to innocent people........

    but when we understand the reality, as Sri Vaasudeva says in Bhagavad Gita....everyone enjoys or suffers the reaction of the actions they have performed...which means,
    those who undergo "Total destruction of homes, properties and lives" actually have performed an adharmic karma, and are experiencing the result of the same...

    now "maybe" it could be those invaders in their next birth are the victims of an earthquake or tsunami or floods....everything that happens has a background to it...
    only when we consider the long run of events we understand the reality...else we are left completely confused at each and every event....


    also one must remember that the reactions need not be exactly same but are definitely similar...example:if you had donated a few gold coins, expecting a return, in the previous life, you may get back a few dollars or euros or rupees in return in this this life[it need not be gold itself]....

    each and everything that happens within this materialistic universe is bound by time and the action and reaction concept....

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    Re: God and natural evil.

    The answer is relative positioning of the different layers. For the monocells and living cells in the food, the action of eating and digestion is beyond their control and harmful for them. But it is necessay for us.

    The earthquake or the other natural calamities are out of the churning that happens inside or above earth. The precipitation or readjustment is to bring the system to new equillibrium. It affects us but it is necessary for earth.

    The earth is again a small element in the solar system and galaxy. The rotation and revolution, the pulls of the other spatial elements and the inhabitants of earth affect the equillibrium of earth over which it does not have any control.

    So the layers of existence exert influence on each other and also get affected.

    This is normal and natural. There is no evil in this.
    Love and best wishes:hug:

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    Re: God and natural evil.

    In general, the Problem of Evil [whether natural or human] is a difficult one for ANY theistic system including Hinduism.

    In syllogistic form, it can be stated as follows.

    P1:If God exists, there will be no gratuitous evil.
    P2:There is gratuitous evil.
    C:God doesnt exist.

    This is the atheistic argument.

    The theistic argument is as follows.

    P3:If God exists, there will be no gratuitous evil.
    P4:God exists.
    C:There is no gratuitous evil.

    All theodicies are variations of this basic theme.

  7. #7

    Re: God and natural evil.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rudy View Post
    Hello forum members

    Why do you think God allows natural evil?

    I know we have karma for our actions, but why do things like Earthquakes happen to large amounts of unrelated people for example?

    I look forward to the answers.
    Namaste Rudy,

    Did you know that there is a cycle of tectonic activity (earthquakes) which is loosely related to the positions of Jupiter and Saturn, and thus to sunspot activity and other universal shapes happenings? The weather on our small planet it compleetly linked to the magnetic activity of the Sun, in accordance with above all, Jupiter(see intro to Astrology for beginners B.V. Raman)

    Time is the deciding factor here and time knows of no good or evil, even the Deva are subject to these laws, only Brahma is out side of this.

    If you are killed in an earthquake and your karma has been so good that you are reborn as a prince in an exotic beautiful and fruitful land; where is the evil in this happening?

    Good and evil are perspectives. We must try to realise that our spiritual perspective is continually changing, the black and white of the yin-yang symbol is a very good representation of this. As there is white in the black and black in the white.

    Do you see?

    praNAma

    mana
    Last edited by Mana; 22 April 2012 at 10:35 AM.

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    Re: God and natural evil.

    Quote Originally Posted by wundermonk View Post
    In general, the Problem of Evil [whether natural or human] is a difficult one for ANY theistic system including Hinduism.

    In syllogistic form, it can be stated as follows.

    P1:If God exists, there will be no gratuitous evil.
    P2:There is gratuitous evil.
    C:God doesnt exist.

    This is the atheistic argument.

    The theistic argument is as follows.

    P3:If God exists, there will be no gratuitous evil.
    P4:God exists.
    C:There is no gratuitous evil.

    All theodicies are variations of this basic theme.
    There is no single technocrat God, Gods came after existence sprouted (Nasadiya Sukta) and evil and good is just the balance shifts of existence itself.

    Sounds reasonable to me. But I'm dumb... So please spot the logical flaw in my postulation.

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    Re: God and natural evil.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pietro Impagliazzo View Post
    There is no single technocrat God, Gods came after existence sprouted (Nasadiya Sukta) and evil and good is just the balance shifts of existence itself.
    Still IF evil exists [in whatever form] God is not omnibenevolent/scient/potent all together.

    The existence of evil pretty much makes a tri-omni God non-existent.

    The interesting thing for me would be to see how much Karma/Reincarnation help "solve" the Problem of Evil.

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