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Thread: Dilution of knowledge

  1. #1
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    Angry Dilution of knowledge

    I've always been a very firm believer of this since childhood. Before I even encountered Sanatan Dharma as a 'path'. I only became religious seriously about a year ago. I wanted to dicuss this.
    WARNING: Kind of a long thread.

    I really honestly think at this point there is almost no recovery for society as a whole. The disintegration of societies moral fabric is far too rapid - and 'humanity' in totality is really in a pickle. While I think there are ways that we can prevail and illuminate the darkness per say (even through the Kal Yuga) it's almost impossible. I might be young but I've been around alot, gang violence, murder, sex, drugs, disregard for anything beyond sense gratification, disrespect to god, hatred towards religion, lust, greed, and many such illicit activies. Through gods grace and my parents ideals I didn't get involved in anything even though I was and am friends with people who are involved in all of it.

    Now let me dismantle my thoughts as best I can.

    The Dilution of knowledge is apparent now more than ever. The ideals of the ancestors are not being passed on at all. There should be a fine balance being struck, the false misinterpretations and the wrong doings from the past must be destroyed and the good should be taken and merged with our current knowledge to create a more absolute truth.
    Whats happening? Either nothing is taking or only the bad things are remembered. In terms of Hinduism as it is passed down from generation to generation

    * - Less individual(s) in total and in (general) have the same amount of knowledge
    * - Knowledge is being diluted as time moves forward

    If generation A (in general) understood the supreme truth, Generation B (in general) may understand half and Generation C (in general) may understand little to none. This is not an accurate depiction merely an example.

    Now sure there are exceptions, but there are exceptions to every rule - in general though this is the trend. We aren't even half way into the age of ignorance, the coming generation will have even less knowlege and even less individuals will be enlightened and have higher understanding of things...

    that is not all, you must factor in, by that time the world will be far more entangled in earthly desires, technology will have gone into overdrive, it will be far more difficult to supercede everything and find god. Human mentality would have completely changed, people will find it more difficult to believe in god even if Sanatana Dharma is all over the internet! People will be more brainwashed to question each and everything they see about god and rather than thinking/understanding they will say there is no proof. The world will be in complete delusion. Even right now there are many individuals who if they knew about hinduism they would embrace it with open hands, it fills in the 'blanks' to their lives - yet they have knowledge of other abrahamic faiths, this lack of flow of information is not likely to remedy in this time cycle at ALL, unless there is a revolution. I even think theres a chance bhuddism will become far more popular and widespread in the western world 3/4 generations from now.

    Many people will think I'm over exaggerating but I'm dead serious. I thought the same as a kid in the 90's and I'm seeing it before my very eyes now. The concept is very cohesive and drawn out in my mind but is difficult for me to map it out here in words.

    Another quick example, Musicians. Let me draw hip-hop as an analogy as its a very 'now' genre and I'm a rapper myself.

    * In the 80's and 90's Hip hop was about poetry, speaking the truth, politics, how literate you were, so and so forth, soon the mainstream had ignorant and posotive music but there was a balance so it was fine. Now it's about having sex with as many women as possible, getting drunk as possible, going clubbing every night (in the mainstream ofcourse). Now I won't get into details of the industry, what real hip hop is, and all these things but lets just talk about knowledge moving forward in regards to dilution.

    Let's use an analogy (this is not accurate ofcourse) I'm trying to simplify this AS much as possible to get my point across. Let's assume there are 100 artists in the underground scene, and 100 in the mainstream. (The radio, very popular, widespread, and what not.)

    Early 90's
    underground rappers : All 100 made good music.
    mainstream : 50 made posotive music. 50 made bad music.

    Late 90's
    underground rappers : 100 in total. 50 made good music. 50 made bad music.
    mainstream : 100 in total. 20 made posotive music. 80 made bad music.

    Early 2000's
    Underground Rappers : 10 made good music. 90 made bad music.
    mainstream : 10 made good music. 90 made bad music.

    Now
    Underground Rappers : 5 make good music. 95 make bad music.
    Mainstream : 2 make good music. 98 make bad music.

    This perfectly shows the dilution of knowledge and disintegration of society. It's not an exaggeration either. One must remember there are infinite factors and facets to this problem and its impossible for me to summarize this.
    Remember mainstream music is such that appeals to everyone its for the common denominating factor of society and to the widest audience, the fact that mainstream audience now is so foul that music must be constantly dumbed down and simplified is a reflection of how ugly society is at the moment. Before rappers had to tell stories, paint pictures, teach and preach, now they have to just talk about drinking alcohol on a fancy beat and the youth who don't wish to seek knowledge in a thing so relevant in their daily lives such as music, how will they for other things. Don't get me started on government, businesses, people, and politics.

    Now take this, if this is the situation now, how will it be in 10 years? in 20? in 30? in 100? Not nice. and this isn't happening just with music its happening with EVERY single FACET of our life. The dilution of knowledge is prominent.

    The common argument will be "Shiven you FOOL, things like this have always been around they have just not been as visible!"

    Okay. That's true. Now you tell me? Thats not a problem? Why do I worry so much they say....Why do I care...? For one I'm going to be a father one day. I'll have a family. Do you understand how disgusted I am with society? I'm scared to bring a girl into this world, I don't know if I can, I have no idea if I can do her justice.
    Every day subliminally a girl is told how to look, how to dress, and the influences on them are disgusting. How will you stop your own daughter from being a whore? I won't go into this but I can draw hundreds of examples which weren't present before...its honestly and truely messed up.

    You know my class mates are quick to pick up girls have sex with them and drop them, but when I ask them, how are you going to stop your daughter from being a whore without you even knowing, not even having the slightest inkling....they are dumbfound. No response.

    I see girls, drinking alcohol till they can't move, having intercourse with any man that wants to enter her, where is the integrity, the dignity, the respect? The ignorance makes my blood boil. Really does.
    The supreme irony? The parents think she is a wonderful girl who just studies all day, her future husband will likely think she has 1 or 2 boyfriends max...when she has had over 100 sexual partners....admit it or not. It's now a part of the culture. It's EMBEDDED into society. It will be a big deal just to not be a sinner soon.

    I think some of the older members dont actually realise how disgusting some of us are, think of the bad things you used to do to have 'fun' and multiply it by 50. One of my friends got slapped by somebody and his friend got angry and went to this person and didn't say anything and just cut his hand off. He asked 'why'? He said thats the same hand you slapped my friend with and walked off.

    This is not the only problem I have, it's just one. Of millions. Oh and alot of these girls are well educated, infact they do it more. Knowledge is power, but without wisdom its useless. The youth are the future, and the youth are disgusting. I'm not saying our ancestors haven't done things that they shouldn't have but its getting worse. Just as the righteous people are reducing the ignorant will increase. Please understand I am generalizing but its to make a point I understand that not all youth are like this and what not thats not something you need to point it.

    Now assume I was to make a point about this to a girl while her friends were there.

    In the early 60's most of the friends would have screamed, sighed, shouted at her friend! Don't do this! God will not forgive you! It's wrong so and so forth.

    In the 2000's? Maybe one friend will say this is wrong, another will say its her choice. Another will say I do it to we are humans we are primitave creatures we all like to have sex who cares, another will say something similar so and so forth

    So what will happen in 10 years? 50 years? 200 years?

    Do you see where I'm coming from?
    Like right now I feel odd expressing my righteousness infront of sinners, but I still do so because my brute nature gives me respect. In 10 years? will people even listen?

    Dilution of knowledge is prominent and the speed at which it is happening is increasing.

    I don't even know how to explain it properly. This is just a drop in the ocean I would have to write a book in this forum post to get my point across, this is a very small part of the picture that I see in my mind, a speck in the magnificent universe....so please try and understand that
    but what are your thoughts
    on the dilution of the universe, on the Kal Yuga, and on the future?
    Sorry for rambling I look forward to your opinions.

  2. #2
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    Re: Dilution of knowledge

    Hello !

    Well...Some years ago I was thinking the same as you. I do not say you are wrong, nor you are right, I am no judge of anything. You raise many points and have a very good mind, for worrying about some things like how will be your future girl, it proves that you are a kind heart.

    This world is perfect. Yes. This world is God, thus he cannot be bad, or imperfect.
    Yet very bad things are happening in humanity. This is not a part of God, all you see is Karma at great scale. Human beings are driven by karma, by good and bad actions, and they will take the consequences or the benefits of them. Imagine million of people, some people more powerful than others, all this karma drive humanity and makes society what it is.

    You talk about music. I used to judge music, to say I like this and not this, the fact is that now I listen everything. From anytime. There is no good or bad in films, in music, there is just tastes.
    There is no devolution in my personnal view, there is change. This change can be good or bad, Sanatana Dharma can disappear or ending misunderstood, but there are many ways of finding God.

    Raising childrens in those times is a difficult thing, I totally agree. I am only 20 but I am well aware of it. Few years ago I didn't even wanted to have any children. Now, maybe I will have one someday, maybe I will end up without it, who knows ?
    But if one day I have a child, he or she will not be raised with the thougt that the world is bad.

    The main problem is not only the childs, it's not only the messages telling them how to be. I was raised with television, with messages telling me how to look, what to think, what was good, what was bad. It's not that, that determine what a child will be, it's his parents.

    Let's take an exemple: as I work in videogames, I often come across parents complaining that videogames makes their childs violents, and that videogames are the reason why their childs are violents. Let's look at the facts:
    - The bloody and violents videogames are for a mature public and a big 18+ make anyone buying a videogame aware of this.
    - These parents let their childs play videogames whenever they want, for incredibly long amounts of time without stopping.

    These parents ignore the signs saying that videogame is not adapted for their childrens. When you say that to them, they answer: "But, he wanted this one !"
    Yes, your 8 year old boy wanted an 18 year + game to play. So you buy it. This is not logic. You say no and explain why.

    These parents says, "he don't want to stop playing and he is violent with me!"
    When I was a child, and my mother said "stop", I stopped. If not, I was hit by her. A child cannot do what he want whenever he want, he have to learn that he have duties to do too.

    Society is the same. The childs are like this because many of them are raised like this. The teaching we receive is determinent, and if you are aware of that, then you will be able to raise a good child.

    I understand frustration. This society is just changing. Nothing is lost, everything transforms, that is all. Many people are awful. You are not from these ones ? Then live in this society as a good one, go on your personnal journey into this world, but don't be angry or too much worrying. Be calm, confident, because no one can meditate with anger.
    Peace

    Aum~
    ~Aum Namah Shivaya~

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    Re: Dilution of knowledge

    Thankyou for your reply McKitty, and I appreciate your opinion.
    Regarding music, yes I agree with you. My life revolves around music heavily, I have external harddrives just so I can store all my music...I merely said (good/bad) music for my example/analogy. Although I know where you are coming from!

    As far as video games go, I'm a avid gamer myself, a large part of my life revolves around them too, I've owned every console from every generation and a gaming PC. It depends on the individuals maturity level and if the child can not decipher game from reality it is the parents responsibility to ensure they monitor such activity I agree.

    I agree with almost everything you said, however I agree anger is 'wrong' but there must be a reason for it to exist past us just supressing it, and I think Lord Shiva emdodies that, anger that is used (when mastered) for the greater good, or to move forward or bring revolution may be useful. I think if it is your cue to fight you should wage battle I don't think god would want you to cower in such a situation. I respect some hindus for being calm and composed when others criticise them and just ignore it moving forward and continuing their spiritual progress. I don't respect hindus. however that let others step on them.

    The world is perfect. The world is god. Humanity is bad. If so, why is it not us that strive to make this place as beautiful and harmonious as possible? Make it equivalent to one of those higher realms where some of us are destined to take birth? why dont we transcend gods expectations of us?

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    Re: Dilution of knowledge

    Hello,

    I am sorry as I have not the answers of your question. In fact, I'm not even sure if there is a real answer...
    God is in every man, and every man is an emanation of God, in my opinion. So, it's not humanity that is bad, it would be the same than saying that God created imperfection. We all have a potential, and I think humanity is the reflection of how we use it.
    The human being is not bad, an action can be bad or good, and thus produce good and bad results. If many and many people makes wrong choices that bring wrong actions, then the mirror will reflect those bad actions.

    Why humanity can't make good choices always ?
    I don't know, honestly. The world saw many revolutions, many civilisations fall and rise, maybe big things are bound to happen for change, maybe not.
    Transforming the whole place by ourselves, at so great scale, isn't a waste of time and energy for a so short life ?
    In US people shout in the street saying "Stop eating fast food, it's bad!" Do people listen to them ? Not really. In fact, they look like weirdos and nobody really listen to them, even if they are saying clever things.

    I think it's better to look at the human scale. If you wish to change something because the world turn bad, do it. But more importantly, do it so people can look at you and do the same. Donate food, support animal shelter, collect money to make something, organize something for some action. This is, in my opinion, the result of mastered anger. This is a way to fight without holding a weapon and without hurting anyone.

    The fight is won when you inspire people. Inspire people to do the same, to think the same, and you will see things changing. It is not simple, it is a responsability, but it is a good way to put your vision and your anger in a good use

    Aum~
    ~Aum Namah Shivaya~

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    Re: Dilution of knowledge

    You put that very well. However I think its worth it yes, if all individuals thought like that many things wouldn't have been done. I mean it's a personal mission for me to spread Sanatana Dharma to as many willing ears as possible to close the information gap, and those who think it is the correct path for them they can use it to supercede their current state and transcend to another, because otherwise they may have never seen that knowledge. I already have certain plans for this.

    I definetely agree with your mastered anger remark though, inspiration and the fighting without holding a weapon, it's one of my dreams to thus open a charity revolving around Hinduism, ending poverty, but it wouldn't be a conventional charity ;] (Like my grandfather used to buy school admissions for the poor, rather than one meal, or money for one day, that way they can gain knowledge and exercise it to feed themselves for a lifetime. He used to give free tuition to all the poor kids in the village and such.) In that respect it will be a very unconventional charity but with conventional roots.
    Last edited by IcyCosmic; 02 May 2012 at 06:47 AM.

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    Re: Dilution of knowledge

    Hi,

    You are a very motivated person, it is a very good thing as it's kinda hard to find in times like this. I like the way of thinking of your grandfather too, he must be a very good person.

    Be just careful with the though of preaching Sanatana Dharma. As it is a very vast way, divided in many way of thinking, it's better for an individual to wonder on the path by himself and to forge a good opinion. I think it's even very bad for an Indian person to try to convert someone saying Sanatana Dharma is better. Because one of the root of Sanatana Dharma is the respect for other's beliefs and having the mind as wide open as possible for thinking "every god is the same god, thus mine cannot be superior".
    That is why Sanatana Dharma is more than just a religion, it's a whole way of life and thinking.

    Why not talking about the benefits of Sanatana Dharma ? It's okay to discuss with people. But be careful not to be like some Christians and some Muslims, trying to prove that your vision is better. It's okay not willing to follow Sanatana Dharma, it's okay to be from another background, from another religion. Christians do charity too. But some christians do charity only in exchange for converting people or talking about how Jesus is better than everyone else ect...

    I'm not saying you are from those ones, don't worry ^^ The fact is that I don't know you well enough to tell what you are. Just be careful no to be insistent to people and not to take them from above because you think Sanatana Dharma is better than everything else.
    Surrender your actions to God, Shiva, Vishnu, Ganesh, Buddha, Allah, Durga, whatever form God takes to you or to other, it's not important. What is important is the actions you take

    Again, this is a just a personnal view, I'm not the truth, I can be wrong. But it still my way to see it.

    I wish you good luck if you want to help people. It is very hard and the world needs more dedicated persons, whatever religious background they have.

    Aum~
    ~Aum Namah Shivaya~

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    Re: Dilution of knowledge

    Thankyou for the valuable advice Haha, no I won't pester people or tell them our path is more supreme to theirs not at all.
    Thanks again

  8. #8

    Re: Dilution of knowledge

    Namaste IcySFX, McKitty,

    If I may propose another way of looking at this, I to have meditated similar thoughts in the past. Time flows it does not run, its passage is not linear or straight. When seen from this perspective it can be perceived as either dissolution of knowledge, or as an acceleration of time her self. Time has many sub periods and ebbs and flows; this is quite normal, knowledge is always there.

    The current dispersal of energy that you describe very well, its appearance will enable you to rise above with greater ease, as it is so visible Siva is harder to forget.
    All the more reason to concentrate on the words of those wise Rsi, Saints and Guru who have described so eloquently their vision of That, and how to proceed in life with this knowledge in the heart.

    Humility is of the utmost importance when dealing with those who are less aware; knowledge and reason spoken with love in the heart, are the only things that can make a difference ego must be left behind for this.

    Remember that you are in no rush, keep studying and I am sure that you will see the right path for you though this time.

    praNAma

    mana

    Aum Namaḥ Śivāya

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    Re: Dilution of knowledge

    Namaste Mana, Thanks for the words. I agree with you

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    Re: Dilution of knowledge

    Hello Icy

    Those were my exact thoughts a few years ago, so I understand how you really feel about this. I was well aware of it even as a child like you in the early 90s.
    I always felt weird about being the only 1 to realise such things... i mean i dont think any of my Hindu friends had such a deep realisation that Hinduism is on the brink of extinction and all that.

    I could have become like most other Hindus my age, being ignorant about religion and enjoying myself without much limits. In fact, I never really thought of myself being a religiously-inclined adult whenever i imagined myself being grown-up, and im sure my parents never imagined me being religious too.

    But then a few years ago i took a stand and told myself that i had to do something if i wanted this great religion to be around longer. I knew i had to do something. So i started reading many books on Hinduism and asking many questions and thus educated myself in my religion. And i feel old and weird because i sometimes realise that i know more about Hinduism than my parents and older relatives. Its fun for me though when i see their shocked faces whenever i explain to them something. Haha, that i out of everyone would have such an interest.

    But i have an aim, and that is too make us younger ones realise the greatness of our religion, Hinduism, and to spread its knowledge as best as i can.

    Hinduism has everything in it and i feel the perfect religion for not just the spiritually inclined but for everyone. I just dont understand why some people convert out of Hinduism. To me it has everything necessary in it for a beautiful and perfect life.

    No doubt Hinduism is going to be extinct in a few centuries due to ignorance and westernisation. This has always worried me.
    Unless we do something about it today, i feel its going to disappear. That's the sad part. But nevertheless, im determined to keep it alive for many generations to come. haha...

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