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Thread: continuum of consciousness

  1. #21
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    Re: continuum of consciousness

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté

    I have mentioned in post 16 above :
    The experience becomes that of Self and non-Self. The world is divided into this simple model. There is the silence of the Self, and there is everything else.

    The 158th śloka of Vivekacūḍāmaṇi says the following:
    pāṇi pādādimān deho nātmā vyaṅge'pi jīvanāt |
    tat- tacchakter anāśāc ca na niyāmyo niyāmakaḥ ||
    The body, consisting of hands, feet and so on, cannot be the SELF because one lives without these limbs and continues to function. The controlled cannot be the controller.


    This is to discriminate between the Self and not-Self (ātmānātma vivekaḥ). If one wished to get more information
    on this, please consider the following HDF post found in the uttara folder: http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=4033



    praṇām
    Last edited by yajvan; 22 May 2012 at 07:48 PM.
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  2. #22
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    Re: continuum of consciousness

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté

    What then is next after turiyatit chetana (sustained turīya) ?

    It is the expansion of Self called ātmavyāpti (ātma+vyāpti) that expands into creation; It is the pervasion of Self into the world of perception, the world of objects and things. Just as this awareness of the 4th (turīya) expanded into wake-dream-sleep, now it expands like oil poured on a smooth surface , into creation.

    The śiva sūtra-s (3.39) says it this way:
    citta sthitivaccharīra karaṇabāhyeṣu ||
    In essence this sūtra says one's awareness or consciousness of (citta or cit) moves (cara) outside (bahya).

    Well what does that mean? One begins to appreciate that Self not only pervades him/herself internally via turiyatit chetana , it also pervades the world.
    This level of awareness some call bhagavat chetana. The word bhagavat means 'divine'. It is given to viṣṇu-kṛṣṇa , ṣiva, mother divine (bhagavatī). Some times the divine is called bhagavan or bhagavantaḥ ( as a group).
    The point here is the individual's experience is that of seeing the divine in His/Her creation. One now has this divine awareness to appreciate the divine within creation.
    We can then see from personal and direct experience, one can become the bhāgavata - the 'follower' of the divine, of bhagavan. Because now it is a personal experience. No pretending, no mood making, but a direct personal experience of Īśvara's creation on the level of the senses ( touch, taste, smell, etc).

    Hence the continuum of consciousness as a graphic:
    wake-dream-sleep >--------0-----0-------0

    The 1st stop after wake-dream-sleep was turiyatit chetana ; the 2nd stop just reviewed is bhagavat chetana; another stop
    exists, the 3rd stop. We will review this in a future post.


    praṇām
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  3. #23
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    Re: continuum of consciousness

    Namaste Yajvanji

    This is a wonderful thread. Thank you.

    I recall an older thread touching on turiyatita chaitanya, bhagavat chaitanya, etc., in which Atanuji pointed out a lack of Shruti support for this concept.

    Would you mind elaborating on the sources of this information?

    I am not dismissing these teachings by any means because of a lack of (apparent) shruti support, but I am curious as to the basis.

    Dhanyavad

    Namaste

  4. #24
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    Re: continuum of consciousness

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté

    Quote Originally Posted by Shuddhasattva View Post
    .

    I recall an older thread touching on turiyatita chaitanya, bhagavat chaitanya, etc., in which Atanuji pointed out a lack of Shruti support for this concept.

    Would you mind elaborating on the sources of this information?

    If we review the conversation with atanu-ji his position was that there was nothing beyond turīya i.e. turīyatita. That was the crux of the conversation and postings. Yet that said, the sources of these teachings comes first from my teacher and instruction; The other sources are:
    • śiva sūtra-s and their elaboration found in the spanda-kārikā-s¹
    • mālinīvijayottaratantra - reviews tattvajaya, the various pramātṛ¹ and their experiences of 'fullness'
    • pratyabhijñāhṛdayaṁ - which is part of the trika system i.e. āgama śāstra , spanda śāstra and pratyabhijñā śāstra.
    • I have not mentioned spanda-kārikā-s ( as some would think) as this śāstra offers the vehicles to unfold these levels of consciousness.
    I mention the list above from kaśmir śaivism as they are more articulate and detailed in their definitions. These are a few yet I will also ask the reader to consider various upaniṣad-s; the one that comes to mind is the brahmabindūpaniṣad & kaivalya-upaniṣad ( the one who attains para-brahman). Yet to the attuned reader we will find various levels of consciousness called out indirectly & directly in the bhāgavad gītā¹ and directly in patañjali’s yogadarśana ( 4th pada).

    Yet there are more references... I will be happy to provide.

    praṇām

    words
    • spanda-kārikā-s
      • 1st niḥṣyanda called svarūpa spanda; offering the essential nature of spanda (śiva) i.e. Śiva's dynamism which is identical with the Self (ātman); 1st to the 25th verse
      • 2nd niḥṣyanda called sahaja vidyodaya; the emerging of Self (śiva) as the whole universe; 26th to the 32nd verse
      • 3rd niḥṣyanda called vibhūti spanda; additional powers (siddhi) gained/acquired via spanda; 33rd verse to the 52nd verse
    • bhāgavad gītā - chapt 4, 35th śloka
    • pramātṛ - perceiver; also in advanced states, it is one who has a correct notion or idea , authority , performer of (the mental operation resulting in a) true conception
      • As one advances to higer levels of unfoldment there are 3 that are called out that relate to the levels of consciousness being reviewed in this string.
    Last edited by yajvan; 02 June 2012 at 08:01 PM.
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  5. #25
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    Re: continuum of consciousness

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namast

    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post
    mālinīvijayottaratantra - reviews tattvajaya, the various pramātṛ and their experiences of 'fullness'
    Here is what this masterful śāstra (chapt 2, 38th śloka), found in kaśmir śaivism, has to say...It is quite profund and delight to read, comprehend and experience:

    pracayaṁ rūpātītaṁ ca samyak turyamudāhṛtaṁ|
    mah
    āpracayamicchanti turyātīta vicakaā ||38||

    Turya -the fourth state of consciousness-- (turyam) is said to be (udāhtam) truly (samyk) pracaya -lit. the mass- (pracayam) and (ca) rūpātītam -the state beyond rūpastha or deep sleep- (rūp-atītam). The wise (vicakaā) wish (to attain) (icchanti) mahāpracaya -lit. the Great Mass, the great fullness, totality - (mahāpracayam) (also known as) turyātīta - lit. beyond the fourth - (turya-atītam) ||38||

    Pracaya, rūpātīta and turya are synonymous. This is the meaning of the first line in the stanza. In turn, Pracaya or the Mass is so called because it is made of a mass of Pure Consciousness. This Mass is also declared to be bind, the fourth body where one experiences the fourth state of consciousness (turīya).
    The wise seek to attain the Great Mass, the Great Totality, which lies even beyond the fourth i.e. beyond the fourth state of consciousness. This sublime condition is said to be "the state beyond turīya", where one transcends all his four bodies and rests only on pure consciousness, his true Essence. All in all, turyātīta and mahāpracaya and synonymous.

    praṇām
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  6. #26
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    Re: continuum of consciousness

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté

    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post
    Yet that said, the sources of these teachings comes first from my teacher and instruction
    ... yajvan, why do you mention your teacher when we are asking about the sources of knowledge found in the śāstra-s ?

    This is all about the verification of knowledge. One knows there is the fullness of truth when there is alignment of 3 components:
    • śāstra or āgama - a body of teaching (in general) , scripture , science authoritative in nature ; sacred book or composition of divine authority
    • ācārya or guru - " knowing or teaching the ācāra or rules " , a spiritual guide or teacher
    • vicāra - (one's own) reflection , examination , investigation
    That is, we read the śāstra-s and they are explained or reconciled by the ācārya, AND we are able to experience
    the knowlege or reflect upon it ourselves for our own comprehension or experience. When these 3 align we have
    the fullness of knowlege that is lively and true.


    What is so unique about sanātana dharma is it provides a check-and-balance system.

    What causes one's consternation is when one hears something and it does not align to what is read, or cannot be experienced. Thus the teacher plays the important role to bring insight and remove doubts.
    Yet even if the teacher cannot remove the doubt then the knowledge in question has to set aside and re-evaluated or dismissed completely.

    It is the teacher that is able to inform you that the snake you are viewing is just a rope; and then, upon further inspection you can ~see~ this to be the case.


    praṇām
    Last edited by yajvan; 04 June 2012 at 08:15 PM.
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  7. #27
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    Re: continuum of consciousness

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté

    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post

    Yet to the attuned reader we will find various levels of consciousness called out indirectly & directly in the bhāgavad gītā ...
    If one takes a careful look at the bhāgavad gītā of 18 chapters, we will see a natural grouping of chapters: 1-6, 7-12, & 13-18.

    It is within the first six chapters that kṛṣṇa-jī offers the knowledge of atma-jñana or knowledge of the Self. When this is accomplished one has then arrived at turyātītā caitanya and the subject reviewed in posts 9 and 16 above.

    Self knowledge = atma-jñana = turyātītā caitanya when it becomes a direct and personal experience, that remains your reality 7 days a week, 24 hrs. a day.


    When we look to chapters 7-12 of the bhāgavad gītā , kṛṣṇa-jī now offers the wisdom of bhakti. It is from the foundation of turyātītā caitanya cultivated by bhakti that one is uplifted to bhagavat chetana, that was reviewed in post 22 above.

    If one recalls, kṛṣṇa-jī shows arjuna his universal form in chapter 11, starting with the 5th śloka. This parallels what I offered in post 22:
    This level of awareness some call bhagavat chetana. The word bhagavat means 'divine'. It is given to viṣṇu-kṛṣṇa , ṣiva, mother divine (bhagavatī). Some times the divine is called bhagavan or bhagavantaḥ ( as a group). The point here is the individual's experience is that of seeing the divine in His/Her creation. One now has this divine awareness to appreciate the divine within creation.
    Arjuna sees the Supreme's universal form everywhere - within the Supreme's creation, seeing the divine everywhere.

    Then in chapters 13-18 of the bhāgavad gītā , kṛṣṇa-jī spends time on additional (refined) knowledge and clarifications as arjuna starts in chapter 13 asking additional questions regarding puruṣa and prakṛti.

    So we are able to see within the bhāgavad gītā , considered one of the prasthāna traya¹, the offering of these higher states of being.

    praṇām


    words
    prasthāna traya - 3 foundations, ways, course , method , systems of vedānta . They are the upaniṣad-s, the bhāgavad gītā , and the brahmasūtra-s - the teaching of brahman, or ātman i.e. brahma-vidya.
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  8. #28
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    Re: continuum of consciousness

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté


    As you recall this string is about śivavyāpti discussed in post one...
    This word śivavyāpti is śiva + vyāpti. Śiva is that wholeness of consciousness. We have a wonderful definition for
    śiva based upon the root śī defined as 'in whom all things lie'; vyāpti is defined as pervasion, omnipresence , ubiquity, full, inseparable.
    So, śivavyāpti is the pervasion of which all thing lie within the Being of śiva. Even differentiated/fragmented consciousness of the
    human condition - there is no place it is not.

    So we have been reviewing the path and unfoldment of this fullness that occurs as one's full-potential is revealed along the way.

    This fullness is referred to in the upanisads in a few ways , called the mahāvākyāni or some recognize it as the 4 mahāvākya-s.
    • prajñānam brahma - (knowledge , wisdom , intelligence) consciousness is brahman; from the aitareya upaniṣad
    • ayam ātmā brahma - this Self ( ātman) is brahman; from the māṇdūka upaniṣad
    • tat tvan asi - that thou art ( you are That, brahman); from the chāndogya upaniṣad
    • ahaṁ brahmāsmi - I am brahman; from the bṛhadaraṇyaka upaniṣad
    These mahāvākyāni have correpsonding levels of personal experience on how one sees themselves in relationship to the universe. This is the unfoldment of fullness, that despots oneself on the doorstep of śivavyāpti.

    Within kaśmir śaivism these levels of consciousness and experience are called out as:
    • sadvidyā or śuddhavidyā tattva - balance between Self and not-Self
    • īśvara tattva - the universe is my own expansion
    • sadāśiva tattva - I myself am this universe
    • The last one is most profound and beyond the ability to put in words called śiva+śakti tattva (combined) - this is just pure I.
    When we are talking of consciousness/levels we call this all-encompassing level of awareness brahmi chetana. It is the consciousness of brahman, of that all-encompassing fullness that is possible. A field of reality where duality does not exist, as all is brahman, I am brahman, I am that fullness of Being.


    Hence on our continuum of consciousness we go from completely differentiated (fragmented) consciousness to totally unfragmented wholeness of Being.
    wake-dream-sleep-turya--------0-------0---------0------- the common thread always being consciousness itself.


    praṇām
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  9. #29
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    Re: continuum of consciousness

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namast


    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post

    When we are talking of consciousness/levels we call this all-encompassing level of awareness brahmi chetana. It is the consciousness of brahman, of that all-encompassing fullness that is possible. A field of reality where duality does not exist, as all is brahman, I am brahman, I am that fullness of Being.
    In the spandakārikā-s (2.4) it calls out this out in a slightly different manner:

    bhoktaiva bhogyabhāvena sadā sarvatra saṁsthitaḥ||

    "The experient (bhoktā) himself (eva), always (sadā) (and) everywhere (sarvatra), remains (saṁsthitaḥ) in the form (bhāvena) of the experienced (bhogya... iti)."


    praṇām
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  10. #30
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    Re: continuum of consciousness

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namast


    Well, where does one start ?

    By grooming nimīlana-samādhi which over time and with practice blooms into unmīlana-samādhi ....
    • nimīlana - with eyes closed; facing inwards
    • unmīlana - 'raising the eyelids' ; with eyes open facing the world
    • samādhi - absorption - but into what ? turīya
    the wise inform us, withdraw, then withdraw from the withdrawal

    This is one sure path...


    praṇām
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

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