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Thread: Utter basics.

  1. #11
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    Re: Utter basics.

    hari o
    ~~~~~~

    namasté


    For one that takes up meditaition as a upāya¹ there are many approaches no doubt. I have read no less then 112 methods found in the vijñāna bhairava kārikā-s . The brillance of this work when in the hands of the competent muni ( teacher) uplifts the aspariant (student) and unfolds their experience of pure consciousness. Pending one's dispostion, focus, & intent, various techniques are available for each practitioner.

    Yet you mention,
    I struggle to even think my thoughts In an uninterrupted way - it feels like the older I get, the shorter my attention span is.

    If the mind is wandering, no worries... The lord of the mind is the breath. Consider managing the breath and this will manage the mind. This is one firm place to begin.

    praām

    1. upāya - approach, technique, way to achieve.
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  2. #12
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    Re: Utter basics.

    Vannakkam: Yajvan has made excellent point as it starts with the breath. In my Guru's method, after sitting straight and comfortable, that is the first place to put awareness, on pranayama, and once that is established, then to move on.
    As for the difficulty of the matter, in Patanjali's 8 limbs, http://www.expressionsofspirit.com/yoga/eight-limbs.htm

    please note that meditation is number 7, and if we take them as being sequential, it is pretty high on the list.

    I had great difficulty sitting still as a young man, and then when the five kids came along, just working to feed them took much of my time (dharmicly) , so there were several years there when anything but a weekly temple visit was more or less out of the question.

    I believe as we age, we often add more to the dross (subconscious) mind. Unless we are aware of this, and are able to release some of the emotional congestion as we travel along, indeed meditation would become even more difficult, just due to all the mindstuff that's in there. Similarly with the overly intellectual person. The mind is just so full that thoughts are jumping all over hither thither.

    There is a 'pressure' to be able to meditate in certain circles, and coming from within. I think it is an influence from the west that goes back to one life versus reincarnation. There is no hurry. It is a natural outcome of the previous 6 limbs in Patanjali's sutras. So when you beat yourself up over it, it only adds further to the emotional congestion, which is practically a step backwards. So why not do stuff that you are capable of doing? It builds confidence, will, and all this can be carried into all future spiritual endeavours, and one day you'll be able to sit still through the night, having birds land on your head.

    This 'pressure' can come from peers who are 'meditating' and it is not at all unlike any other form of teenage peer pressure. Many need to take a really good honest intellectual look at themselves. Whether or not a person is an effective meditator can often be seen the the actions while not meditating. Is anger under control? Is buying under control? Does the person do anything valuable for society and others? etc.

    Aum Namasivaya

  3. #13
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    Re: Utter basics.

    Quote Originally Posted by mradam83 View Post
    Namaste.

    Apologies for asking such a simple question, but what Mantra is used?
    Namaste

    Any mantra. Any real mantra has a deity. That deity is to be visualized or otherwise focused on in essence when doing the mantra after sufficient practice with the mantra japa itself.

    This is because mantra is shabdabrahman. Shabda is sound, and from the various levels of vibration, form is made manifest and differentiated in name. The mantra is the acoustic representation of the deity's form and essence. There's an excellent explanation of this concept in The Garland of Letters by John Woodroffe (Arthur Avalon).

    Namaste

  4. #14

    Re: Utter basics.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shuddhasattva View Post
    Namaste

    Any mantra. Any real mantra has a deity. That deity is to be visualized or otherwise focused on in essence when doing the mantra after sufficient practice with the mantra japa itself.

    This is because mantra is shabdabrahman. Shabda is sound, and from the various levels of vibration, form is made manifest and differentiated in name. The mantra is the acoustic representation of the deity's form and essence. There's an excellent explanation of this concept in The Garland of Letters by John Woodroffe (Arthur Avalon).

    Namaste
    Namaste.

    Many thanks for this. I have downloaded a mantra/prayer app on my phone called ipuja. I will look through it and find the mantra that corresponds to Lakshmi, Ganesh etc.

  5. #15

    Re: Utter basics.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eastern Mind View Post
    Vannakkam: Yajvan has made excellent point as it starts with the breath. In my Guru's method, after sitting straight and comfortable, that is the first place to put awareness, on pranayama, and once that is established, then to move on.
    As for the difficulty of the matter, in Patanjali's 8 limbs, http://www.expressionsofspirit.com/yoga/eight-limbs.htm

    please note that meditation is number 7, and if we take them as being sequential, it is pretty high on the list.

    I had great difficulty sitting still as a young man, and then when the five kids came along, just working to feed them took much of my time (dharmicly) , so there were several years there when anything but a weekly temple visit was more or less out of the question.

    I believe as we age, we often add more to the dross (subconscious) mind. Unless we are aware of this, and are able to release some of the emotional congestion as we travel along, indeed meditation would become even more difficult, just due to all the mindstuff that's in there. Similarly with the overly intellectual person. The mind is just so full that thoughts are jumping all over hither thither.

    There is a 'pressure' to be able to meditate in certain circles, and coming from within. I think it is an influence from the west that goes back to one life versus reincarnation. There is no hurry. It is a natural outcome of the previous 6 limbs in Patanjali's sutras. So when you beat yourself up over it, it only adds further to the emotional congestion, which is practically a step backwards. So why not do stuff that you are capable of doing? It builds confidence, will, and all this can be carried into all future spiritual endeavours, and one day you'll be able to sit still through the night, having birds land on your head.

    This 'pressure' can come from peers who are 'meditating' and it is not at all unlike any other form of teenage peer pressure. Many need to take a really good honest intellectual look at themselves. Whether or not a person is an effective meditator can often be seen the the actions while not meditating. Is anger under control? Is buying under control? Does the person do anything valuable for society and others? etc.

    Aum Namasivaya
    Namaste.

    What you say about adding to the subconscious mind is true in reflection - the older I've got, the more I've tended to stress about matters such as money and work etc. I should listen to the Gita more and realise that money is not a real thing per se and concentrate on what is real and I do have. Not easy though.

  6. #16

    Re: Utter basics.

    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post
    hari o
    ~~~~~~

    namast


    For one that takes up meditaition as a upāya there are many approaches no doubt. I have read no less then 112 methods found in the vijāna bhairava kārikā-s . The brillance of this work when in the hands of the competent muni ( teacher) uplifts the aspariant (student) and unfolds their experience of pure consciousness. Pending one's dispostion, focus, & intent, various techniques are available for each practitioner.

    Yet you mention,

    If the mind is wandering, no worries... The lord of the mind is the breath. Consider managing the breath and this will manage the mind. This is one firm place to begin.

    praām

    1. upāya - approach, technique, way to achieve.
    Namaste.

    So would you say breath should flow and I should concentrate on it as a basic?

  7. #17
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    Re: Utter basics.

    hari o
    ~~~~~~


    namast

    Quote Originally Posted by mradam83 View Post
    Namaste.
    So would you say breath should flow and I should concentrate on it as a basic?
    Begin with the breath... If you have great interest , please send me an email and I will offer you a few pointers that may help.

    It is basic yet very effective. It is something all can do.

    praṇām
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  8. #18

    Re: Utter basics.

    Quote Originally Posted by yajvan View Post
    hari o
    ~~~~~~


    namast



    Begin with the breath... If you have great interest , please send me an email and I will offer you a few pointers that may help.

    It is basic yet very effective. It is something all can do.

    praṇām
    Namaste.

    Please do. I will PM you my E-Mail address.

  9. #19
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    Re: Utter basics.

    hariḥ oṁ
    ~~~~~~

    namasté


    We have many posts on aṣṭāṅga ( 8 limbs) of yoga, patañjali’s yogadarśana here on HDF. It seems a better understanding of the framework may be of interest...

    The key to the 8 limbs is wholeness. The brilliance of patañjali’s insight & offering is the 8 limbs begin with satyaṁ and ends with samādhi. That is, we start from wholeness in seed-form and end with it fully bloomed in samādhi; yet these 8 limbs are not sequential.

    It's as if we're baking a cake. All the ingredients are there together and the cake rises at the same time when in the oven ( tapas). Like that, all 8 ingredients of yoga work together and the cake rises, you rise up out of ignorance.

    This is the brillance of the offer. Many think ' oh I cannot capture this samādhi , I will ty it later after I become perficient in the other yama's' . This is not the case - samādhi¹ is one of the 8 ingredients to make the cake rise. In the beginning this experience of samādhi may be short lived but is the building block for experiences down the road to expand in time.
    While it is doing this, all the other limbs begin to take root. Just like a root it is underground. It takes a little time for one of the stems to shoot up above the ground and we then take note - and continue the practice.


    praṇām

    references

    More on samādhi is reviewed on this HDF post:
    http://www.hindudharmaforums.com/showthread.php?t=8070&highlight=sam%26%23257%3Bdhi
    Last edited by yajvan; 20 June 2012 at 06:51 PM.
    यतस्त्वं शिवसमोऽसि
    yatastvaṁ śivasamo'si
    because you are identical with śiva

    _

  10. #20
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    Re: Utter basics.

    Vannakkam: Some consider the practise Patanjali coded as limbs; others consider them as rungs. Some consider it (the system) sequential, and other see it more as a simultaneous practice. In reality, its probably some of both.

    I found this explanation: http://swamij.com/yoga-sutras-22629.htm Not sure of the sampradaya of the source.

    One thing I'm sure of ... I have not personally touched limb 8 ... not even close. But all glories to those who have.

    Aum Namasivaya

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